Farn Leader
ID: 451044109 Tue, May 22, 2007, 02:49
- Umaga got the 5 points in the opening promo because for one he doesn't talk anyway and his being there adds to the promo.
- Lashely was wrestling what was defined as a gauntlet match. In the past anyone wrestling a gauntlet match was given points for one match because the idea is if they lose at any point on the gauntlet it was over. So not all the matches were guaranteed and were thus all part of one match. So in that case its all one large match. This can certainly be debated but I'm going on past scoring for now.
- Vince only got 2 total for the continuous tv watching. We have always given just one set of promo points for an ongoing promo, whether is interupted by a commercial or camera change or not. Its all one promo that never ended.
Khali's interpreter = 2+2+5+ Maryse +5
(I apologize for my ignorance but I assume the 3 girls in Extreme Whatever are the same 3 I gave points to on the sheet?)
If we determine each Lashley gauntlet match is completely seperate than he should have a total of 130pts including promos during the night.
2
Great One Sustainer
ID: 053272014 Tue, May 22, 2007, 09:05
I've been giving them 5, considering their "dancing" to be a promo since they are the focus for the 2 minutes in the middle of the ring.
We could give them a big fat ZERO for what they actually contribute to the show though lol...
3
Great One Sustainer
ID: 053272014 Tue, May 22, 2007, 09:34
I know you said you could go either way on the gauntlet and I gotta say... I think as ridiculous as it sounds, I would have scored it as 4 different wins.
Especially since after both Masters and Viscera matches he went to the back and they went to completely different matches afterwards.
And they did keep saying "he needs to run the gauntlet" but they never (i don't think) really called it a "Gauntlet Match" which I think is the big difference. And if it all was one match, then do Masters, Viscera, Umaga get main event points as well then?
I could go either way as well, but we should maybe take up a little informal vote here and sort this out.
4
Farn Leader
ID: 451044109 Tue, May 22, 2007, 09:46
totally agree GO. This one is not a standard decision. Normally the gauntlet is all at once.
The argument can be made for both sides. Had he lost it was over which had me thinking it was one match. But honestly I'm very fine with either decision.
5
Mike D Leader
ID: 41831612 Tue, May 22, 2007, 09:51
Tough call. With matches in between, I'm inclined to call them seperate matches.
6
Great One Sustainer
ID: 053272014 Tue, May 22, 2007, 09:54
Lets just let Goat decide. Cliff - would you rather have 40 points or 140! points lol...
Actually Species should probably just be the tiebreaking vote. 3 main scorers, each score one show, each have one vote for scoring questions... very democratic and balanced.
I too would have considered Lashley's matches to all be seperate...
8
GoatLocker Sustainer
ID: 060151121 Tue, May 22, 2007, 11:49
I'm going to abstain from voting, since you all know how I would vote.
Let's see what Species thinks. Or anybody else for that matter.
Cliff
9
Great One Sustainer
ID: 053272014 Tue, May 22, 2007, 11:52
Well based on the early poll's (Mike and Bobo that is...) I think we are leaning towards splitting up the match.
Too early to declare a winner though!
11
Species Dude
ID: 07724916 Tue, May 22, 2007, 12:20
As I watched it, in my head I considered it one gauntlet match. If I was scoring, I would have scored it a Main Event win for Lashley, and that's it. I would have only given main event points to Lashley and Shane O'Mac.
IMO, there should be no difference due to the fact that there were other matches in between. The point of the whole show was McMahon saying he had to run the gauntlet, and JR said multiple times that he must win the gauntlet match to get a shot at McMahon at One Night Stand. I know it sucks because Lashley is certainly deserving of more points, but we have all been on that end of a gauntlet match and some point, and they've all been scored the same.
I would be wide open to a scoring tweak for these though. IMO, 140 pts for 1 night, as incredible as Lashley's run was, is just too much for one night without a Championship win. What if it was scored as is - you get a win or a loss in the end of the gauntlet match - but you get a 10 point bonus for every win within the gauntlet itself (but not for the final result, which gives you 30 or 15 to start with). In this case as an example Lashley gets 30 bonus points for a total of 80 which is a more reasonable total score for the night.
BTW - Farn you forgot Umaga's 10 for DQ loss vs. Lashley.
12
Mike D Leader
ID: 41831612 Tue, May 22, 2007, 12:31
That's where watching the show helps define the feel of what was taking place.
13
Greg Rude
ID: 493182913 Tue, May 22, 2007, 12:33
For what it's worth, I agree with Species in scoring it as a traditional gauntlet match and not 4 seperate wins.
I think what sold me for sure, is, (as Farn pointed out) if he had lost the 1st match against Masters, it would have been over. The 3 matches after that wouldn't have happened.
Just my 2 cents though.
14
Greg Rude
ID: 493182913 Tue, May 22, 2007, 12:37
Also, Farn ... just in case I emailed an old address or something ... I shot you an email at your G Mail account (farney)
15
Great One Sustainer
ID: 053272014 Tue, May 22, 2007, 13:02
per wwe.. MOLINE, Ill. – Survival was the name of the game for Bobby Lashley as the ECW Superstar invaded Raw. Lashley’s trip to Moline was definitely not a vacation as Mr. McMahon forced the powerful Superstar to compete in a grueling Gauntlet Match.
I guess if they call it that - then the single match scoring stands.
Secondly, I rather like Species idea for Guantlet match scoring where you get 10 points for each extra leg of the guantlet.
16
Great One Sustainer
ID: 053272014 Tue, May 22, 2007, 13:04
Perhaps we should take a little vote on that proposal so we can use it going forward.
I am in favor.
17
Greg Rude
ID: 493182913 Tue, May 22, 2007, 13:14
I am for that too ... extra points for the gauntlet. Species mentioned at 10 pts for each extra win he would have had 80 total. Wouldn't it be 60 pts? (Which I think is better than 80, 80 is still almost 3 wins) 10+10+10 +30 (final win) = 60? Help me see what I am missing.
Productive day, RWF!
18
Great One Sustainer
ID: 053272014 Tue, May 22, 2007, 13:17
Rude, you are correct but forgot the main event points and promos or whatever Lashley had on this particular night.
19
Farn Leader
ID: 451044109 Tue, May 22, 2007, 14:43
I would be in favor of the extra points for "running the gauntlet"....and my goodness, every gauntlet match I have ever seen was not broken up at all, like that match last night...why I am surprised that WWE broke the mold?
21
Great One Sustainer
ID: 053272014 Tue, May 22, 2007, 14:59
To give Lashley a breather? To stretch it out further? who knows lol...
Tell ya what I was thinking. Lets see, we are dropping like flies with main eventers getting hurt one after another... I've got an idea! lets put the guy who just met with Dr.James Andrews a week ago in 4 matches! And in one of them specifically, we'll have him bodyslam the 500 lb Viscera and jump through tables into a Samoan Bulldozer etc.
22
Farn Leader
ID: 451044109 Tue, May 22, 2007, 15:09
LOL. So true GO. Some times I wonder if Vinny Mac is drunk when he writes these up.
Anyway, I'm in favor of extra points for pieces of a gauntlet. It would make it more fair when a guy has a night like that.
23
Species Dude
ID: 07724916 Tue, May 22, 2007, 15:29
I am also in favor.
So the proposal is:
"A gauntlet match, where a wrestler or team takes on a series of opponents in a single show will be scored as one match. The end result will be a win or a loss versus the final participant in the gauntlet match. However, as a bonus, the wrestler(s) involved will earn a 10 point bonus for each victory during the gauntlet match leading up to the final match of the gauntlet."
Sound about right? The above helps eliminate any debate about "all together" gauntlet matches or strewn out gauntlets over a single show.
Hell I'd even vote to make it retroactive to the start of this season and include them for this match.
24
Species Dude
ID: 07724916 Tue, May 22, 2007, 15:32
The retroactive part is separate...but right now this new gauntlet bonus is leading 5-0 (Species, Farn, GO, Bobo and Rude) and needs 1 more vote to pass.
25
Mike D Leader
ID: 41831612 Tue, May 22, 2007, 15:44
Agreed.
26
Species Dude
ID: 07724916 Tue, May 22, 2007, 15:48
Agreed to what? That a vote for making this points retroactive is separate?
Or agreed to pass the motion to add 10 for each win leading up to the final match of the gauntlet?
27
GoatLocker Sustainer
ID: 060151121 Tue, May 22, 2007, 15:48
Agreed
28
Great One Sustainer
ID: 053272014 Tue, May 22, 2007, 15:49
Should we also specify that all the opponents recieve singles or tag team match points for their segment of participation in the gauntlet? or is it just kind of implied?
29
GoatLocker Sustainer
ID: 060151121 Tue, May 22, 2007, 15:51
to the proposal.....
30
Great One Sustainer
ID: 053272014 Tue, May 22, 2007, 15:52
Unfortunately, I don't think we can make it retroactive. Any time we've made major rules adjustments we've always done "from this point forward" type of thing.
31
Great One Sustainer
ID: 053272014 Tue, May 22, 2007, 15:54
Although, I guess since this has yet to be finalized there is some grey area for this show in particular. I would be in favor of allowing that scoring for this show as it has yet to be finalized.
Not that there were any other guantlets in the last 3 week anyway (were there?) lol... I guess that tag team one the night after Wrestlemania would have qualified.
32
Species Dude
ID: 07724916 Tue, May 22, 2007, 16:37
Proposal passes. I will add to the official scoring rules.
GO - we have always awarded regular match points (usually losses) for the gauntlet opponents, be they singles matches or tag teams (or handicaps, for that matter).
33
Farn Leader
ID: 451044109 Tue, May 22, 2007, 17:32
Species, can you go ahead and draw up something official in the scoring page to include ECW too so there are no questions about that?
34
Species Dude
ID: 07724916 Tue, May 22, 2007, 18:04
Took me a while to find the vote, but I've added that bro.
35
Farn Leader
ID: 451044109 Tue, May 22, 2007, 18:06
atta boy.
now can you find that vote that says any trades between wiggs and farn can be rescinded within 7 days of a finalized trade?
36
GoatLocker Sustainer
ID: 060151121 Tue, May 22, 2007, 18:24