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Subject: Giving up
Posted by: mIST
- [5351150] Mon, Mar 01, 2004, 05:33
Sorry guys but I think it's not fair to keep playing without being active. Unfortunately I don't have time for this anymore... it's a pity because I was the one who started this "fantasy WWE" thing and I loved taking care of it. I hope we'll meet again soon, I will come here to say hello every now and then :)
Enjoy! |
| 1 | Mike D
Sustainer
ID: 41831612
Mon, Mar 01, 2004, 08:07
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Bummer. Take care, my Italian friend!
Looks like we'll be down to 10 teams......
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| 2 | Mattinglyinthehall
Leader
ID: 1629107
Mon, Mar 01, 2004, 08:54
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Contract baby!
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| 3 | Great One@ Work
ID: 40150137
Mon, Mar 01, 2004, 09:24
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that sucks... but at least we'll have an even number of teams again.
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| 4 | Great One@ Work
ID: 40150137
Mon, Mar 01, 2004, 10:48
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I am really intrigued to see the standings now with those teams eliminated... some of the guys who were too low for me to consider swapping with now might work.
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| 5 | Great One@ Work
ID: 40150137
Mon, Mar 01, 2004, 10:50
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ahh.. Mist was pretty high actually.. so not that great a shift.
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| 6 | wiggs
Donor
ID: 4991311
Mon, Mar 01, 2004, 12:57
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sorry to see you go mIST. Thanks for getting this started for the rest of us. I hope that this doesnt have anything to do with me running away with the league this year (I dont want that to sound cocky) but I know sometimes when you feel that there is no hope of catching up it is hard to stay active.
If we do contract, maybe we should consider starting 8 and benching 2 totaling 10 per team, any ideas?
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| 8 | Mattinglyinthehall
Leader
ID: 1629107
Mon, Mar 01, 2004, 13:03
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I dont think I like that idea at all, Wiggs. There cleary isn't quite enough talent to go around for 12 teams to each have 6 viable starters. 8 starters on 10 teams brings that number up, from 72 total to 80 total. Also, it actually shrinks the free agent pool by 4 wrestlers.
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| 9 | wiggs
Donor
ID: 4991311
Mon, Mar 01, 2004, 13:17
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I thought the exact opposite. Seems like there will be to much talent out there. I think having 2 less teams out there will make teams to stacked. If you take all mISTs players along with Sponges, you will not only have the top 10 scorers in the league as FAs, but you will also have talents such as:
Benjamin
Lita
Rock
Booker
Farooq
Foley
Conway
Taker
Bradshaw
Cena
Henry
Michaels
Nunzio
High scorers for each team as of last post of standings:
Dvon
RVD
Tajiri
jericho
Orton or Benoit
Goldberg
rhyno
eddie
brock
Bischoff.
Any of those guys/girls would be a great fit on anyones team. That is 24 wrestlers. Each manager keeps 4 drafts 2 each thats fills the starters and there is still 4 of these guys left.
It doesnt matter to me what we do, but it would seem like a waste to have talent such as Rhyno on someones bench.
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| 10 | Great One@ Work
ID: 40150137
Mon, Mar 01, 2004, 13:25
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I would say pretty much all of our bench/start decisions are no brainers.. this might actually force us make some decisions.
Keep the starters short.
I had an idea the other day when looking at my Yahoo teams...
I would be in favor of something along the lines of an extra bench spot - kind of like the IL spot in Yahoo - where you keep a guy - i.e. Paul London, Dinsmore, - he is yours, on your bench - BUT if you wanna activate him you gotta drop someone else.
A call up spot I guess.
Just thinking of ideas to shake things up a little... Not sure if it would make things more difficult to score. I guess its just another bench spot... just another idea...
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| 11 | Great One@ Work
ID: 40150137
Mon, Mar 01, 2004, 13:41
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even so, with inujuries etc.. you can pretty much forget Foley, Rock, Goldberg, Henry, Faaroq (Flair?) right off the bat. And Bischoff is surely coming to an end... Nunzio is a benchwarmer. Rhyno has been until recently...
We all might wind up with 6 solid starters would be the thing I would see happening. That should balance things out, right?
And then someone along the lines of the Rock on the bench for his annual return - or Henry or whoever else is injured.
Rhyno(for illustration purposes) should have been a benchwarmer the whole year. Only scored 200 all freakin' year. Lets say he was on MISTs bench... would have sat there all year and filled in nicely when Henry went down. That should be the job of the bench guy.
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| 12 | GoatLocker
Sustainer
ID: 60151121
Tue, Mar 02, 2004, 22:12
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Sorry to see you go Mist.
Take care and maybe we'll see you back later.
Cliff
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| 13 | Species
Leader
ID: 7724916
Wed, Mar 03, 2004, 09:08
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Good luck mIST, you made the league fun and your work on the points so many weeks was appreciated by all!
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| 14 | Tree
ID: 5251612
Sat, Mar 06, 2004, 18:37
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mIst - thank for starting this thing. it's been fun, and we'll miss ya. who knows, maybe we'll make an expansion slot for you next season! hehe...
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| 15 | Great One
ID: 4237716
Sun, Mar 07, 2004, 17:41
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speaking of giving up...
Tree - is it true the ROH owner got caught in an underage sex case or something like that? The police chief in my town was in the same sting - and they mentioned that the promoter of this organization in PA was also busted the same way...
Anyone know of a new wrestling game coming out for me to buy...?
I can't seem to find any concrete info. I might just go back and buy a used Smackdown HCTP.
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| 16 | Tree
ID: 5251612
Sun, Mar 07, 2004, 20:49
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Tree - is it true the ROH owner got caught in an underage sex case or something like that? The police chief in my town was in the same sting - and they mentioned that the promoter of this organization in PA was also busted the same way...
yea. it's a looooooooong story. Rob Feinstein was caught by a group called Perverted Justice. while he wasn't actually talking to a 14-year-old boy like he thought he was, he did go to meet the "boy", and he was met with TV camera. Ring of Honor is saying that Feinstein is no longer with the company.
i'll cut-and-paste some news stories for y'all so you can avoid the pop-ups. i'll post them in the order they have appeared, all from PW Insider.com ...
if you want to see the chat RF had with the "14-year-old boy", since that where it all started, go here...
RING OF HONOR PROMOTER CAUGHT IN UNDERAGE STING
by Dave Scherer @ 11:41:51 PM on 3/3/2004
Ring of Honor promoter, and I believe at least partial owner, Rob Feinstein was one of the subjects of an undercover sting operation by Philadelphia’s Channel 10 news team to find men who use the internet to meet underage partners.
In an investigation conducted in tandem with the Perverted-Justice.com, a website that goes into online chat rooms posing as an underage child to find what they call “online sexual predators”, Channel 10 reported that Feinstein came to the sting house to meet what he thought was a 14 year old boy that he met in a chat room. Initial footage in the piece showed Feinstein running to his car from the front door when a Channel 10 reporter instead of the boy who told Feinstein that he was home alone opened it.
The piece then went on to chronicle two other men who came to the house to meet what they thought was a 14 year old girl before finishing by mentioning Feinstein by name and showing pictures of him, calling him “Robert Feinstein” and saying that he was a Langhorne businessman that promotes wrestling events. They showed a picture of him at an event from his website. They said that according to his chat log, he thought he was meeting a 14 year old boy at the home. The investigative team then went to his home and office to get a comment from him, but said that he did not make himself available.
At the end of the piece, the reporter said that some people from the piece said that they would seek help while in other cases law enforcement officials will be making arrests. The anchor promised to keep us updated on a later broadcast.
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PRESS RELEASE ISSUED BY WEBSITE INVOLVED WITH ROB FEINSTEIN SITUATION
by Mike Johnson @ 2:21:00 AM on 3/4/2004
The Perverted-Justice website sent out the following press release in regard to the Rob Feinstein story that was covered here late Wednesday by Dave Scherer. The release reads as follows:
Philadelphia news affliate NBC10 and ourselves at Perverted-Justice.com recently came together to set up a "Group Media Bust" in Philadelphia, Pennslyvania. A "Group Media Bust" is an agreement where a media outlet rents a house or apartment, gives our site the information, and we work chatrooms as underage individuals, sending overage individuals to the house to meet the cameras and be exposed for their acts.
At roughly ten PM on February 29th, Perverted-Justice.com contributor "Jay Alternative" messaged the owner of Perverted-Justice.com inquiring for information on wrestling due to an individual messaging him online who represented himself as a wrestler. What followed is a story that is amazing, even to ourselves at Perverted-Justice.com.
Ring of Honor owner Rob Feinstein had messaged "Jay Alternative" in an Philadelphia AOL homosexual chatroom and responded favorably to the idea of meeting a 14 year old boy for immoral purposes. Rather than go into description, we will provide the following link of the chatroom transcript:
www.perverted-justice.com/index.php?archive=RFWrestling
The conversations span two days, and two phone calls. Both individuals who had contact with Rob Feinstein while under the auspices of being a 14 year old boy named Brandon are not wrestling fans. They know very little about wrestling. And they had no clue who Rob Feinstein was until he came across our volunteers. Rob Feinstein was not targeted by our organization. Instead, he ended up targeting one of our contributors and is now paying for that decision.
Rob Feinstein showed up at our Group Media Bust door to meet NBC Philadelphia reporter Harry Harriston the day after he initiated the conversation with "Brandon". This occured on March 1st. Feinstein ran to his silver Lexus, and peeled off from the scene of the meeting. This was all captured on camera.
Confirmation that the individual is indeed Rob Feinstein was performed by the investigative team at NBC10, who used video analysis and a license plate lookup to make sure that they had the right man. Every safeguard was taken in the two days since Rob Feinstein made his Philadelphia media appearance to know without a doubt that the person involved was Rob Feinstein before this happening was made public by our website.
Perverted-Justice.com is ashamed at Mr. Feinstein's terrible act, and his reckless disregard for his Ring of Honor/RFVideo employees.
However, to make sure the record is clear, Perverted-Justice.com is not anti-wrestling in any form. This situation is not a "black eye" on wrestling, or indicative of the average wrestler or wrestling promoter. Speaking personally as the owner of Perverted-Justice.com and as the individual drafting this release, I am a wrestling fan myself. This incident is not a reflection on wrestling. This is a solitary incident of an individual who clearly needs some form of counseling, no different than any other of the 600+ individuals we have exposed in nearly two years of work.
We call on Rob Feinstein to seek counseling immediately, to apologize to those around him whom he has harmed via his irresponsible actions, and to apologize to his hard-working employees who deserve absolutely none of the negative taint that Rob Feinstein has brought down upon them with his actions this week.
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ROB FEINSTEIN ISSUES STATEMENT ABOUT ROH AND RF VIDEO
by Dave Scherer @ 11:01:21 AM on 3/4/2004
The following statement is from Robert Feinstein:
"It is with deep regret that I step down as partner of Ring Of Honor Inc. and President of RF Video Inc.
Due to recent allegations that have been lodged against me it is in the best interest of both companies that until these allegations are resolved that I step down to avoid tarnishing the excellent reputation that has been built over the years of both companies."
RF Video and Ring Of Honor will continue normal operations without interruptions.
--------------------------------
CM PUNK AND CHRISTOPHER DANIELS COMMENT ON RING OF HONOR-FEINSTEIN SITUATION
by Mike Johnson @ 12:22:00 AM on 3/5/2004
Christopher Daniels, who has worked regularly for Ring of Honor as a main eventer since their debut in February 2002 sent PWInsider.com the following statement in regard to the current situation surrounding ROH owner Rob Feinstein:
"In the last twenty-four hours there has been a lot of speculation about the future of Ring of Honor. I want to take this opportunity to say that I am proud of everything I've done in a Ring of Honor ring, and I will not let the actions of one man overshadow the efforts that I, and the rest of RoH's roster, have put forth to make Ring of Honor one of the most popular independent companies in the US. I will continue to support Ring of Honor and all the wrestlers who are part of this company."
Joe Mistretta sent along a link to an interview CM Punk did with ChicagoWrestling.com in regard to the Feinstein situation.
In the interview, Punk (who is head trainer of the ROH Wrestling Academy) stated, "[Feinstein's situation] doesn't affect my situation, it just infuriates me. I'm ROH, and I'll see it through....I'm pissed, I'm sad, I'm angry that all the hard work 100s of people have put into this wasn't taken into account by the actions of one selfish person. I'm one of the most selfless people here at ROH. All the boys in the back know that ROH is a family, and we look after each other. We put others before ourselves, and we will continue to do this to put out the best product we can. Bottom line: I fit in here because everybody works hard to be the best. I will continue to work hard, it's all I know."
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RING OF HONOR CAN SURVIVE, BUT ONLY IF ROB FEINSTEIN WALKS AWAY
by Mike Johnson @ 1:24:00 PM on 3/5/2004
Honor: good name or public esteem
Bootlegger. Jerk. Arrogant. Goofy. Aloof. Loser.
All of these words have been used to describe Ring of Honor owner Rob Feinstein in the past by online critics. To be fair, Feinstein has had his share of immature moments and silliness so not all of the criticisms were unwarranted. For better of worse, Feinstein has shrugged off the insults and built himself a successful video business over the last decade and a half. When ECW went down, Feinstein's video business was hurting and Feinstein needed to fill the void. That void was filled with the birth of Ring of Honor. Over the past two years, since the formation of ROH, Feinstein had redeemed his image as a person to many online through the sterling operation of his wrestling promotion. Even his harshest detractors couldn't rip ROH for their product or their professionalism. Throw in the sheer fact that the promotion had begun to do something that no one else could hope to accomplish. They grew, they broke even, they built a following, in part due to their synergy with the RF Video machine at their side. They were the teflon wrestling company. Feinstein had gone from dirty tape dealer to legitimate wrestling promoter.
ROH was the saving grace for fans who wanted their fill of good wrestling. It was for fans who missed their ECW, the better parts of WCW. It was for fans who wanted a taste of the Japanese style in their local venues. It was for fans who didn't want to be talked down to by promoters. It was for fans who had respect for the wrestling business. It was for fans who believed in the concept of Honor in professional wrestling.
ROH is one week out from their biggest event ever. Held in the shadow of Wrestlemania, fans from across the country and the globe were to converge in Elizabeth, New Jersey to get their taste of Honor. The promotion had peaked their storylines. They had worked hard to get their backlogged video releases out in an attempt to maximize profits. The hard work of the wrestlers, the staff, and even the loyalty of fans who had supported ROH with their dollars for over the last two years were about to be rewarded as the promotion was moving towards a fever pitch. 2004 was looking to be the biggest year ever for ROH as they were going to be moving into new markets, and 3/13 was the springboard to get there.
Then Monday happened.
Honor: A showing of usually merited respect
To say the last several days of following the Ring of Honor-Rob Feinstein situation has been surreal is an understatement. In a whirlwind of Internet and then mainstream media hoopla, Feinsten was snared by anti-pedophile website Perverted-Justice.com while seeking a private audience with what he believed to be a 14 year old boy for his alleged sexual purposes. According to the chat transcript, Feinstein used photos from ROH's website and even claimed to be a "wrestler" while talking to the would-be child. Only when he arrived at the house, a news crew was waiting for him. Feinstein fled, leaving behind whatever life he knew prior to exiting his car and walking up to that fateful house.
Rob Feinstein shattered his life on Monday. On Wednesday, when he was publicly outed for his actions, he shattered the lives of everyone who believed in his promotion. He spit in the faces of his staff. He crapped on his wrestlers. He slapped his fans. He was caught on video, with tons of proof against him building to that video, in what one can only call the worst scandal to ever hit a wrestling promoter, because that's what it is.
There is no way to spin this. OJ Simpson can walk around free as a celebrity after being absolved of criminal guilt in the murder of his ex-wife and another, but allegedly want to touch a child? You are done. Be a person known publicly in some circles, and things are even worse than that because now everyone you are connected publicly to is hurt as well due to guilt by association. That includes Feinstein's businesses, Ring of Honor and RF Video. As long as they are associated with a man who went to a 14 year old's house with alleged criminal intent, they too, are done.
Imagine the remainder of the ROH staff, trying to fix this problem because one sick person they are all connected to is alleged to be doing among the worst things one could get caught doing. This isn't a public relations nightmare. It's the death knell for a promotion and rightfully so. ECW's Mass Transit situation doesn't seem so bad now does it?
Honor: A person of superior standing
On Wednesday morning, Perverted-Justice.com posted Feinstein's picture and chat transcripts on their website. Links ended up posted on ROH's message board shortly thereafter. The board was shut down and has since been deleted. With rumors swirling around message boards as commercials for that evening's NBC Affiliate in Philadelphia's 11 o'clock news promised a story about online child predators, RF Video was quiet. Can you blame them? Who knew how bad the fallout was going to be?
It was worse than anyone could have envisioned.
At 11 PM Wednesday, the story aired and outed was Rob Feinstein, complete with photos of him holding the ROH championship belt. Feinstein was portrayed as running away from the news crew, peeling off in the same Lexus he had bragged about in the chat transcript. The story also reported he refused to talk to the news crew twice afterwards. An ROH staffer spoke to me right after the story aired. "I have tears running down my face," the staffer said. What could one even say to console this person? One cannot feel anything but sadness for those who are forever affected by the terrible actions of someone who desperately needs help.
Rob Feinstein's actions haven't just damaged his own life, but the life of everyone who depended on him to be a responsible employer, on everyone who put their heart and soul and trust into Feinstein being on the up and up. They put their hopes in Feinstein trying to build a dream into a reality, and to do right in trying to create that reality. Instead, Feinstein has failed to prove he had the one quality that his promotion has been built up around since day one - Honor.
Honor: A keen sense of ethical conduct
On Thursday, Rob Feinstein issued the following statement to his staffers, fans, and the Internet at large:
"It is with deep regret that I step down as partner of Ring Of Honor Inc. and President of RF Video Inc. Due to recent allegations that have been lodged against me it is in the best interest of both companies that until these allegations are resolved that I step down to avoid tarnishing the excellent reputation that has been built over the years of both companies."
If that is the best Feinstein has to offer to the public, no matter where his mental state is after the situation of the past several days, his companies are doomed. Ring of Honor, which has had been the model of how to deal with problems publicly since their inception, was now criticized and taken to task for what, at best, is a stumbling statement that did little or nothing in the way of explanations to their fans or their staff. The teflon promotion is scorched badly and everyone who is associated with ROH in any way, shape, or form has been disgraced.
Rob created this snowball with his irresponsible actions. He needs to take the ultimate responsibility to atone to the staffers who have worked hard for him. It's time for Rob Feinstein to permanently resign from RF Video and Ring of Honor. Now.
No one will believe the company can save itself otherwise. It's a long shot as it is. Even once he resigns, many won't believe he is gone to begin with anyway so this is not the easy answer for the short term. It is, however, the only hope for the long term.
For Feinstein to say he is "stepping down as a partner" in the companies he founded and then to turn around and say he is doing so while the "allegations are resolved" is yet another sign of disrespect for his staff and wrestlers. He left the door open that he at best, may return one day, or at worst, is still around without an official title. No one truly believes he will be able to remove himself from what has been the center of his life for the last decade with a statement like that. No one believes he is trying to repair his life. Just what does the "allegations being resolved" mean, anyway? That no criminal charges will be filed? That it's been six months? How can these allegations ever truly be resolved in the eyes of the anyone who knows or will know about that broadcast?
This statement isn't damn near good enough. Rob Feinstein needs to remove himself from the company, effective immediately out of respect for everyone who worked for him that he wronged with his actions. There is no other way out of this one. There is no turning this around. There is no positive spin. There is no way to babyface being outed as an alleged pedophile on your local NBC affiliate. None. It's disgusting and there is no defense. None.
This is not something that will blow over. This is not something that will end up with business back as usual. Whether charges are filed are not, this is not something a sizable donation to a children's charity will "make right." Feinstein's life is over as he knew it.
Ring of Honor and RF Video though, have grown to be more than Rob Feinstein. There is a crew in that office that do not deserve to see their hard work and really, their dreams of making a living in this business, destroyed for one person's actions. ROH did not go to that house. There are workers who have risked their bodies, hell their lives inside the ROH ring, to build his company into what it is. They did not go to that house.
Ring of Honor posted the following on their website today:
"ROH has never been about individuals.
ROH is a team concept. It consists of the most dedicated professionals driven by pure pride to deliver the best performances ever witnessed in a pro wrestling ring. These athletes devote their lives to their art. All is sacrificed from family to friends to personal health for one goal- to produce the best show you'll ever witness in the spirit of ROH. The competitors in the ring feed off the energy of the crowd to produce the special atmosphere that can only be experienced at a live ROH event. We live for that moment when you people are awed, amazed and ignited by the action, spirit and pulse so unique to ROH.
Most importantly ROH is made up of survivors. People who persevere and perform at their best when the pressure is on. We can take the hit because we know how to survive. We have been hit hard and we have survived every time. We are a team that can't be broken. We have a bond that extends from all the wrestlers to the fans and nothing can destroy that bond because we have dedicated our lives to it. The ROH team remains intact - our athletes, our staff, and most importantly, all of our fans."
It's time for Rob Feinstein to take the ultimate hit for the team he disgraced. It's time to be gone forever from the company, publicly and privately.
This is not an easy decision for Feinstein to make by any means. To walk away from everything he built for himself over the last ten years is not something anyone can do without regret and confusion. However, he needs to understand that his actions this past week instantly eradicated all the work he has done to build his company. He needs to understand he gave every prospective enemy, past, present, and future, the ammunition to use against the company. Most importantly, he needs to make this decision for himself, knowing it is for the good of the company.
Feinstein needs to hope that leaving now is enough to make up for the heartbreak and hurt he has inflicted on those associated with him. Feinstein needs to sell his interest in the company, walk away, and sign up for whatever counseling he so deeply requires to deal with his problems. Then, he needs to publicly announce it, disappear, and hope for the best in putting his life back together. He's lost everything. He needs to make sure those who worked for him have a fighting chance to not lose the same.
It's the one honorable act left he can commit.
Mike Johnson can be reached at Mike@PWInsider.com.
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ROB FEINSTEIN REMOVED FROM ROH AND RF VIDEO OWNERSHIP
by Mike Johnson @ 4:00:00 PM on 3/5/2004
Ring of Honor released the following statement this afternoon concerning their ownership:
March 5, 2004
Statement from
Douglas I. Gentry
New President and CEO
RF Video, Inc. and Ring of Honor, Inc.
"As a result of a personal incident in which Mr. Feinstein was involved, both RF Video and Ring of Honor have made some necessary changes in both management and ownership of our companies. This was a personal incident and RF Video and Ring of Honor as corporations were not involved.
RF Video and Ring of Honor are family-friendly organizations. We value all of our customers, vendors and business partners. As a result, the board of directors of both corporations voted officially this afternoon to release Robert Feinstein as president and CEO of both RF Video and Ring of Honor. As of today, Mr. Feinstein is no longer officially associated with either company or any upcoming events and I was named as the new President and CEO of both corporations. He has been dissolved of all responsibility and ownership in both companies. Our corporate attorney is currently working on all the necessary paperwork. We are also exploring a new name change for RF Video, Inc. and we will have more details soon.
We want to thank you all for the many positive messages we have received from hundreds of you, including fans, talent and business partners. We are very excited about the many upcoming wrestling events in 2004! "
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Mike Johnson interviews Ring of Honor booker Gabe Sapolsky
this is four pages long. if you want to read it, follow the link. Gabe is a good guy, i've known him for a lot of years....
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i think that's it...sorry for the long post...
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| 17 | Great One
ID: 141172214
Mon, Mar 08, 2004, 20:37
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The police chief here in Jersey (who also happens to be one of my friends dad) was busted in the same sting... its really disturbing, and really weird to see, especially when I see how his daughters are affected. Just sad.
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