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Subject: Myanmar
Posted by: Perm Dude
- Dude [030792616] Mon, May 05, 2008, 10:50
While we were arguing about whether Rev Wright loves America more than Barack Obama...
4000 death, 3000 missing from cyclone disaster on Myanmar (Burma).
This is one of the most isolated countries on earth (isolated for many reasons, but human trafficking and opium production come to mind...). Still, a disaster of epic proportions. A chance to do good here might open up an otherwise repressive country.
As I recall, Myanmar lost thousands in the tsunami a couple of years ago, but wouldn't let aid workers into the country to help. So maybe this is just another lost opportunity in the making. |
| 1 | Perm Dude Dude
ID: 030792616 Mon, May 05, 2008, 10:55
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CIA page on the former Burma:
Burma is a source country for men, women, and children trafficked to East and Southeast Asia for sexual exploitation, domestic service, and forced commercial labor; a significant number of victims are economic migrants who wind up in forced or bonded labor and forced prostitution; to a lesser extent, Burma is a country of transit and destination for women trafficked from China for sexual exploitation; internal trafficking of persons occurs primarily for labor in industrial zones and agricultural estates; internal trafficking of women and girls for sexual exploitation occurs from villages to urban centers and other areas; the military junta's economic mismanagement, human rights abuses, and policy of using forced labor are driving factors behind Burma's large trafficking problem tier rating: Tier 3 - Burma does not fully comply with the minimum standards for the elimination of trafficking and is not making significant efforts to do so
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| 2 | Boxman
ID: 337352111 Mon, May 05, 2008, 11:17
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Haven't you seen the latest Rambo movie? We just did a bunch of good over there.
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| 3 | Perm Dude
ID: 843768 Tue, May 06, 2008, 09:38
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Toll now past 22,000
Eventually, we'll start getting into "real money" numbers...
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| 4 | Boxman
ID: 337352111 Tue, May 06, 2008, 11:50
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This is one of the most isolated countries on earth (isolated for many reasons, but human trafficking and opium production come to mind...).
Hell, I'm surprised we haven't invaded them yet.
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| 5 | Boxman
ID: 337352111 Tue, May 06, 2008, 13:17
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Since the junta (WTF is a junta anyway?) that runs Myanmar won't allow aid from us right now b/c of politics, would anyone here be in favor of dropping food and medical supplies anyway?
The people of Myanmar probably want and need help and their gov't is too ignorant and oppressive to allow it. So should we just go ahead and do it? This isn't an advocation of using troops or anything like that. Just air dropping supplies.
I know that the Bush Admin seems like they're hanging a carrot out there with the aid, but I think we'd show the greatness of our country a lot better by doing a supply drop instead of using emergency aid as a weapon.
Thoughts?
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| 6 | Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418 Tue, May 06, 2008, 13:34
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So should we just go ahead and do it?
Well, if you mean by "we" the US military, I'd say "no". If you mean by "we" charities, NGOs, church groups, yes, by all means.
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| 7 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Tue, May 06, 2008, 13:47
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What we should do is contribute however poossible to the most effective means of getting food and aid there. If that means shipping supplies to China for them to distribute them or sending funds to the International Red Cross or whatever it takes. The priority and motivation should be saving lives, not showing the world how great we are.
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| 8 | Perm Dude
ID: 843768 Tue, May 06, 2008, 15:33
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I understand that the government there is now allowing aid workers in, and have put out calls for specific needs.
They are also taking a lot of heat for apparently not warning the citizens at all about the cyclone.
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| 9 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Wed, May 07, 2008, 14:16
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Hilzoy @ Obsidian Wings You can help by donating to the Red Cross/Red Crescent, Doctors Without Borders, Save The Children, UNICEF or the World Food Programme, all of which are providing assistance in Burma.
Our government, meanwhile, has decided this is a good time to play politics:"The United States, which has led a drive for economic sanctions against Myanmar’s repressive regime, said it would also provide aid, but only if an American disaster team was invited into the country.
The policy was presented by the first lady, Laura Bush, along with a lecture to the junta about human rights and disaster relief.
“This is a cheap shot,” said Aung Nain Oo, a Burmese political analyst who is based in Thailand. “The people are dying. This is no time for a political message to be aired. This is a time for relief. No one is asking for anything like this except the United States.”" The government in Burma is horrible. But that is no reason to attach these sorts of conditions to assistance in the face of disaster.
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| 10 | Jag
ID: 28457122 Thu, May 08, 2008, 01:43
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Mith,the ones playing politics are you and the NYT.
I have read several articles on this subject, but only seen you and the New York Rag make this a political attack on Bush and a poor one at that, although I am sure other Liberal media are doing the same. The article reeks of bad timelines and out of context comments. The corrupt Burma government is to blame for the slow aid and hopefully this tragedy will call attention to this horrific regime.
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| 11 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Thu, May 08, 2008, 08:36
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Actually I picked it up at Obsidian Wings after I noticed Hilzoy's account showed some similarities with the comment I left in post 7.
By all means, please point out the inaccuracies in the Times' "timeline" and the out of context statements. I'd very much prefer to hear that American aid to Burma is not in any way contingent on politics.
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| 12 | Jag
ID: 28457122 Thu, May 08, 2008, 10:12
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The article tries to give the appearamce that the Bush administration called for economic sanctions at the same time as the diaster and they cherry picked Laura Bush's comments which were directed at the Burma government to let in aid workers.
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| 13 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Thu, May 08, 2008, 10:23
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I really don't see what you could take such issue with in the Times article. In fact after reading it again I think Hilzoy's claim that the government is playing politics is pretty unfounded. It's he who takes the Times' article out of context in claiming that the US is playing politics. I'd like to know what you found so objectionable, Jag.
Anyway, today Hilzoy seems to have dropped the criticism, perhaps because a number of his readers challenged his May 6th post in the comments section.
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| 14 | Perm Dude
ID: 5442688 Thu, May 08, 2008, 10:33
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The article says that the Administration tried to put conditions on the aid. For anyone reading carefully, the mention of the economic sanctions was a historical reference.
Laura Bush: "If we can get some sort of team in there to assess what the other needs are, then I feel very assured that the United States government will follow with a bigger (aid response)."
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| 15 | Jag
ID: 28457122 Thu, May 08, 2008, 12:04
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PD, as a writer, do you notice an overall tone of a piece or tricks used by an author to slant a story, that we lay people may not see?
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| 16 | Perm Dude
ID: 5442688 Thu, May 08, 2008, 12:15
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Sure, Jag. We all do it. That's why I pulled out Mrs. Bush's quote so it can stand on its own.
I don't think there is any question that she is putting a condition upon aid--"let an American team in, and we'll give you more when they report."
This is an opportunity to do good without any conditions (isn't that what Christians are supposed to do?). This is like a tree falling on your house, and your neighbor offering you his chain saw as long as you talk about this ongoing problem with a fence.
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| 17 | Jag
ID: 28457122 Thu, May 08, 2008, 12:46
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More like a tree falling on your neighbor's house and he wants help, but won't let you in his yard.
Relief Organizations need to be careful, the Burmese government is corrupt and will try benefit off this tragedy.
Making a conscience effort to not critize those sick bastards of the Burmese government is difficult. I don't see it as playing politics, just damn near impossible to not mention it.
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| 18 | Perm Dude
ID: 5442688 Thu, May 08, 2008, 13:43
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I complete agree on your last sentence. But Laura Bush specifically wants an American team there, and will condition additional aid upon that. Just because the Burmese leaders need to be put into a dark hole for a long time doesn't make it right to condition the aid. In fact, a very rare chance to directly show the people of Burma how Americans are willing to help would be missed.
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| 19 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Thu, May 08, 2008, 14:24
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an overall tone of a piece or tricks used by an author to slant a story
I thought the problem was with chronology and statements taken out of context. What happened to that?
Regardless, the only specific example you've cited was the Times' characterization of Laura Bush's statements from earlier this week, and in that case, your complaint seems to be that their reporting her criticism of the Junta's failure to warn the people of coming disaster is inapropriate and that they should have focused on the portion of her comments directed at pressuring Myanmar to accept US aid.
So I checked over at how a media outlet you find more palletable reports the same event. The article FOX runs seems to meet your standard by noting first that the First Lady calls for Myanmar to allow aid in. But here's how they put it: First lady Laura Bush on Monday said the United States stands ready to pump more aid into Myanmar to help its recovery from a cyclone so devastating the death toll could top 10,000. But that help is conditioned, she said, on a U.S. disaster response team being allowed into the country. That's the first two sentences in the article. Interestingly, you seem to take exception to the Times' article for employing a "tone" that "tries to give the appearance" that American aid to Myanmar is in some way "conditional". But the article at FOX tells us explicitly that this is precisely what Laura Bush intends. It continues:Mrs. Bush also rebuked Myanmar's ruling junta on other fronts in a rare appearance at the White House press briefing room. She faulted the junta for proceeding with a May 10 constitutional referendum that she described as a sham, and criticized government leaders for not warning citizens about the storm.
"We know already that they are very inept," she said.
The first lady has been a vocal spokeswoman for the administration about Myanmar, also known as Burma, which has been under military rule since the early 1960s. Both Laura Bush and President Bush have criticized the current junta for repressing human rights. Now the country is coping with disaster. So FOX ran an article that started off with an explicit claim that Laura Bush told Myanmar that there are political conditions tied to American aid. And they followed that up with a second and third paragraph about her current and past criticism of the junta, including the specific issue that they failed to warn the people of coming danger. And not only do they run the same Laura Bush accusation as the Times (which you said was inappropriate), but they elaborate on it considerably with at least 6 sentences beginning in the second paragraph of the article (compared with the Times who ran their single sentence about Laura Bush in the middle of the piece).
Now, you've previously expressed your very strong opinion that the placement of unflattering information (and you've already characterized all of this as unflattering when you wrer criticizing the Times for running it at all) about the White House near the top of an article is a certain indicator of anti-Bush bias. I very clearly recall the last time you were furious at the Times (posts 110-113 here), it was because they ran some unflattering information about President Bush in the top 1/3 of the piece and when I pointed out that FOX ran almost the same sentence in their article, you explained that it was completely different because FOX responsibly put it near the bottom. After considering your own stated standards for what constitutes bias and then reading the first 4 paragraphs of that article, that is one serious anti-Bush (particularly anti-Laura Bush) hit job that FOX ran on its website, huh? However you shake it out, the NYT article is a fluff-piece in comparison.
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| 20 | Boldwin
ID: 4643963 Fri, May 09, 2008, 06:11
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You still think liberals should be allowed to call it 'Faux News'?
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| 21 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Fri, May 09, 2008, 07:36
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I don't understand the question. I guess I forgot to include my emoticon smiley face. You think I should reconcile my opinion (regarding bias, anyway) of them because they ran an article on their website that surpasses the standards that Jag set when he was pressed to explaine why he though that the NYT piece is so biased? I'll stick with my own standards, thanks. I suggest you read the Times article and decide for yourself whether it was biased reporting. And if you think Jag is on to something then maybe you can explain to me exactly what they took out of context and how their chronology of events was somehow skewed because, although I've asked him, all he gave was something about a cherrypicked Laura Bush statement that I don't see as problematic at all.
By the way, I watch cable news all day long. I see at least an hour of FNC most days. Usually at least two. And most days I see something that appals me. They're a joke. Political coverage is as biased as any other television news outlet (more explicitly biased than anyone) and this is their idea of a fluff story. They rolled a full length news package about that woman. The story was that this woman has huge fake breasts that she had to go out of the country to get. That's news? I'm down on TV news in general but I'm sorry, CNN's bar isn't that low.
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| 22 | Myboyjack
ID: 8216923 Fri, May 09, 2008, 08:47
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UN withholds aid. I guess the UN will be accused of "playing politics" as well.
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| 23 | Perm Dude
ID: 5442688 Fri, May 09, 2008, 09:11
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Only by those poorly trying to make a point, I suspect.
Pretty sad that the aid is coming from Bangladesh, of all places!
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| 24 | Boxman
ID: 571114225 Sat, May 10, 2008, 13:54
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Time To Invade Burma?
Time Magazine said this, not me.
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| 25 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 37838313 Sat, May 10, 2008, 14:00
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Time Magazine said this, not me.
Box, did you read that article?
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| 26 | Boxman
ID: 571114225 Sat, May 10, 2008, 14:04
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OK, what did I do wrong now?
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| 27 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 37838313 Sat, May 10, 2008, 14:08
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Well, the article doesn't propose a military invasion, it discusses exactly the same thing as what you suggested in post 5.
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| 28 | Boxman
ID: 571114225 Sat, May 10, 2008, 14:12
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They are using the word invasion. I am for unilateral humitarian drops. No troops. To me, that isn't invasion and I think it's misleading to use the word invasion in that case.
I'm not trying to smear Time Magazine, but I perceeeeive the word invasion to indicate a violent military act.
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| 29 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 37838313 Sat, May 10, 2008, 14:19
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I agree their use of the word is strange. Putting it in the title doesn't bother me so much, headlines are sensational. I'm sure I could provide dozens of examples from every shade of media from the past month.
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| 30 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 37838313 Sat, May 10, 2008, 14:23
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They use it in the body of the piece as well, but not in a manner that would confuse the reader. Then in the last paragraph they explicitly dismiss the notion of a military invasion, as if that's what they've been talking about all along. The article is written in kind of a silly way; looks like it trips over itself trying to get cute.
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| 31 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 37838313 Sun, May 11, 2008, 12:01
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EconomistFor foreign donors, Myanmar raises a dilemma seen also in North Korea, which may be on the verge of another famine (see article): how to rescue desperate people whose own government spurns outside assistance, and how to do so without providing a lifeline to an illegitimate and unpopular regime. In the aftermath of a disaster, only the first of these questions matters: when so many are in such need, the humanitarian imperative overrides qualms about giving handouts to a repugnant regime. Nor, on the whole, is there any way of sidestepping the junta (or the North Korean regime) in the distribution of aid. Some foreign aid agencies have existing networks in the country.
In theory it may be possible, as France's foreign minister has argued, to obtain a United Nations' resolution obliging the junta to accept aid. In practice, Myanmar's friends on the Security Council would probably block such a move and it will remain a question of coaxing the generals into accepting help. That means avoiding the risk of feeding the junta's paranoia. It sees the offer of help as the thin end of a wedge of political interference aimed at prising it from power. In this sense it was unfortunate that George Bush's magnanimous offer this week (“Let the United States come and help you!”) was made as he signed legislation awarding a congressional honour to Aung San Suu Kyi, Myanmar's detained opposition leader.
The generals will also have noticed that on the same day Congress passed a resolution condemning their constitutional referendum scheduled for May 10th as “one-sided, undemocratic, and illegitimate”. This is an accurate description of both the process and the constitution the generals want to impose on their people—with such urgency, after 14 years in the drafting, that they have delayed voting in the worst-hit areas by just 14 days. Of course they should postpone the vote. Evil enough in itself as a way of providing some legal cover for the perpetuation of military rule, administering it (and presumably fixing the outcome) is now a distraction from what should be the army's main task: saving lives. However, pressure from America will not make the junta yield. Instead, it will make it even cagier in handling the offers of aid. Postponement would have a better chance if the neighbours who have maintained good links with the junta—Thailand and, especially, China—added their weight to calls for a suspension.
Two faint hopes flicker in the sodden gloom left by the cyclone. The first is the possibility that the need for humanitarian help may lead to a renewed engagement with the West. At the very least it might advertise Western expertise, wealth and generosity, and restore some of the influence that has been lost to Myanmar's big commercial partners in the region. Second, the regime's shocking, bungling response to the crisis might lead even some of its own members to wonder whether their leaders know what they are doing. The army believes it must stay in power because no other force can hold the country together and run it competently. The cyclone must have brought home to some senior soldiers what most civilians have long known, that this is nonsense.
It is not unprecedented for a natural calamity to bring political change: in 1972, the embezzlement by Anastasio Somoza, Nicaragua's dictator, and his cronies of aid sent after an earthquake contributed to the unpopularity that eventually toppled him; more recently, the tsunami was instrumental in bringing peace to Aceh, on the Indonesian island of Sumatra. In Myanmar, superstitious generals and civilians alike will have seen the cyclone as a sign of divine impatience hinting at the looming downfall of a tyrannical government. You don't have to believe in portents to hope that they are right.
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| 32 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Thu, May 15, 2008, 09:52
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On air-dropping aid.
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| 33 | Boxman
ID: 337352111 Thu, May 15, 2008, 13:16
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This author is a fool's fool, or a moron or just a whiner. Take your pick.
Except air drops are not the aid equivalent of smart bombs. Running a humanitarian effort from the skies, like running a purely airborne war, is fraught with problems.
I suppose we should just give up then and let them starve. Pu$$y.
For a start it requires excellent intelligence. Yet no one knows exactly where the worst affected areas are, or how many people are suffering in each place. We don't know if people are on the move, or what diseases are starting to appear, or exactly what state their homes and infrastructure are in.
Well, intelligence indicates a lot of people are fooking dying or will be. I would imagine we or some other industrialized country have a spare commercial or military satellite or two that can look at Myanmar.
Yes, these people are on the move. I'd bet that they'd be willing to move to the crates of supplies falling from the sky too. As long as we were semi-smart about a relative area to drop them over.
"Or what diseases are starting to appear..."
All the more reason to ACT you stupid b!tch.
can't drop a well or a sanitation system from the sky without specialists to set it up.
So let's just quit.
Communities could find themselves with aid completely inappropriate to their situation.
So arrange the contents of the drops for certain criteria. Right now, they have nothing. SOMETHING would be better than nothing.
Without these precautions the aid would be very unlikely to go to the people who need it most.
And I suppose handing everything to the junta solves this problem. R-tard.
Then there is the astronomical cost. Just keeping an aircraft on the runway, ready to go, costs at least $25,000 a day. The most commonly used plane, the Il 76, can carry 20 tonnes of food - enough to feed 40,000 people the most minimal rations for a day. That could mean nearly 40 air drops a day to feed the 1.5m people most seriously affected - a massive expenditure for such a scattergun, uncoordinated approach.
And since when has cost really stopped gov'ts before on a consistent basis. $25,000 a day? Where's Sally Struthers when you neeeeeed her? "For the price of a cup of coffee...."
The Burmese authorities must allow them in to do their job.
BUT THEY AREN'T DOING THAT YOU DAMN PIKER!!!!
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| 34 | Boxman
ID: 337352111 Thu, May 15, 2008, 17:01
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I do regret using that amount of language in one post. I had an honest emotional reaction to that piece (of s#it) and it came out that way. I'm sorry, but I just don't think we should standy idly by in this situation.
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| 35 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Thu, May 15, 2008, 17:03
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For the record, she didn't at any point argue that we should stand idly by.
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| 36 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Thu, May 15, 2008, 17:07
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Further, her background suggests that she probably knows what she's talking about. Certainly more likely than you or I. And I can't think of any reason for why she would take an anti-air-drop position for any political purposes.
Isn't it within the realm of possibility that she's right and an air-drop is a waste of resources that could be much better put to use via other means?
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| 37 | Boxman
ID: 337352111 Thu, May 15, 2008, 17:23
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For the record, she didn't at any point argue that we should stand idly by.
When the choices are dealing with the uncooperative junta or nothing, that's exactly what she's saying.
Isn't it within the realm of possibility that she's right and an air-drop is a waste of resources that could be much better put to use via other means?
Absolutely not. If the gov't over there was cooperative to US assistance, then I clearly see her point. The junta has proven incapable of providing relief, they have been obstructing aid (most likely for their own nefarious reasons), and they are a repressive gov't to say the least. They are probably glad some of their people have died because it positions them to take an even stronger position of power.
There's nothing wrong with air dropping food and medical supplies in a situation like this and her arguments in that article are laughable.
Honestly Mith, if you want to debate this you're wasting your time because I refuse to go around the block with you when it comes to this situation. Clearly the right thing to do is to skirt the junta and try and save the people.
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| 39 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Thu, May 15, 2008, 17:36
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No debate. I'll just that if you are this furious with Barbara Stocking for defending the President's refusal to air drop aid in Myanmar, you mst be absolutely pulling your hair out with rage over Bush, since he's the one who is actually in control of the policy and not just commenting on it.
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| 40 | Boxman
ID: 571114225 Thu, May 15, 2008, 18:27
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Since when was I a Bush apologist? Not to be insulting, but in a contest between you and I, you Mith are the apologist for your guy.
It is very frustrating that he isn't acting on this and rather chooses some sort of agenda and then puts his wife out there in front of the issue on top of it.
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| 41 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Thu, May 15, 2008, 18:37
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You're reading more into post 40 that I intend. It wasn't constructed to accuse you of the opposite of what I asked.
Maybe you and I mean different things with the word apologist. In my view, an apologist is someone who makes excuses for things that are otherwise universally accepted as wrong. That isn't the case here - there is no broad consensus on whether ruling out air-drops is wrong.
But I've never seen you direct such fury at President Bush as you did today at Barbara Stocking. Obviously, Bush is far more attatched to an anti-air-drop policy than Stocking is.
Even in post 40, you refrain from expressing the same level of anger at Bush that you offer even in your toned-down #34. Why is that? I don't think it's an unfair question.
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| 42 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Thu, May 15, 2008, 18:39
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And for the record, Barbara Stocking isn't "my guy". I don't support her opinion or refute yours. I think you've both make some fair points.
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| 43 | Boxman
ID: 571114225 Thu, May 15, 2008, 19:45
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BTW, I've been advocating air drops from day one so of course I'm upset at the Bush Admin. for doing nothing. I also mentioned that I regretted using that kind of language so I didn't want to repeat that in my description of W.
I was referring to Obama as "your guy". Make no mistake though Mith. You are an Obama apologist.
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| 44 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Thu, May 15, 2008, 20:18
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I would agree that I have at times posed undeserved excuses for some of Obama's less excusable statements.
I'm not proud of it but in retrospect there are at least one or two defenses that I regret. We all do it. I bet if I go back and check your pro-Giuliani record I'll find your fair share of apologist stances.
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| 45 | Boxman
ID: 571114225 Fri, May 16, 2008, 06:28
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I bet if I go back and check your pro-Giuliani record I'll find your fair share of apologist stances.
You won't find blog length posts spanning multiple threads like you.
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| 46 | Boxman
ID: 571114225 Fri, May 16, 2008, 06:29
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I'm not proud of it but in retrospect there are at least one or two defenses that I regret.
Care to state which ones you recant?
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| 47 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Fri, May 16, 2008, 07:29
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#45 I don't see why that matters. Pick any topic we've both posted on. Theres much grester liklihood that I've written long posts on it and you have not.
#46 Sure. The first thing that comes to mind is my kneejerk defense of David Axelrod's statements in response to Geraldine Ferraro's comment that Obama's skin color has helped his political ascension.
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| 48 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Fri, May 16, 2008, 07:30
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Don't think I wrote any "blog length" posts or spanned multiple threads on that topic, however.
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| 49 | Boxman
ID: 337352111 Fri, May 16, 2008, 08:50
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So "at least one or two" means just one?
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| 50 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Fri, May 16, 2008, 09:26
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...? Yes. I don't think that's particularly cryptic.
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| 51 | Boxman
ID: 571114225 Sun, Jun 01, 2008, 10:45
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Just Unbelievable
Defense Secretary Robert Gates said Sunday he will make a decision within "a matter of days" to withdraw U.S. Navy ships from the coast of Myanmar, because "it's becoming pretty clear the regime is not going to let us help."
As a result, he said many more people will die, particularly those in areas that can only be reached by helicopters, such as those sitting idle on the U.S. ships.
I don't know what's worse. The military junta not allowing aid in the country or the Bush Admin for not having the stones to drop supplies. I'm just speechless.
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| 52 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Sun, Jun 01, 2008, 11:26
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Does it strike you as odd the dearth of pundits (left and right alike) who have expressed any outrage over the US' refusal to deliver aid without the Junta's compliance?
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| 53 | Boxman
ID: 211139621 Sun, Jun 01, 2008, 11:50
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Does it strike you as odd the dearth of pundits (left and right alike) who have expressed any outrage over the US' refusal to deliver aid without the Junta's compliance?
I am horrified at this situation. I'm shaking my head this morning over it and I can't wrap my head around it. I'm ashamed that our country is doing nothing about this situation. It's one of the first moments for me that I can almost say I'm ashamed to be an American.
Here we have now a policy of pre-emptive war on the basis there MAY BE (at the time it was "we know") WMDs somewhere. Based on that, we drop bombs and put 1,000s of troops into harms way. Yet now we have a situation where WE KNOW people are dying as a result of a repressive gov't that refuses help, even though they desperately need it, after a storm but we won't "pre-emptively" drop food or medical supplies. WTF is going on in this country? Have our leaders, left and right, gone mad?
I don't know why our country, Republican President and Democratic Congress, allows this to go on. I've pointed my finger at Bush and I should point it the Congressional leadership as well for not adequately pressuring him to do something.
I know what you're saying. Why not just capitulate to the junta and give them the supplies. If the supplies sit in a junta run warehouse for military purposes it is probably worse than not delivering supplies at all. I still say drop the supplies unilaterally and let the cards fall where they may.
Everyone here has failed the Burmese people: Bush, Congress, the media, and the American people for not demanding action strongly enough.
Where is the bold leadership in this country at any level? We have a similar precendent for this (under much more tense circumstances I might add) via the Berlin airlift that Kennedy did. In the face of possible nuclear destruction by the Soviet union, Kennedy did the right thing.
In the face of what exactly I do not know, our politicians fail to act.
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| 54 | Boxman
ID: 571114225 Sun, Jun 01, 2008, 11:59
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Does it strike you as odd the dearth of pundits (left and right alike) who have expressed any outrage over the US' refusal to deliver aid without the Junta's compliance?
I wonder if the fear of being labeled as something negative has something to do with that as well.
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| 55 | Perm Dude
ID: 420241913 Sun, Jun 01, 2008, 15:11
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The Administration cannot possibly be labelled any more negatively than it is right now.
I think we're running up against a lack of experience in anything other than my way or the highway thinking.
The problem we have is that the Administration really holds all the cards (also, no one really wants to go against Laura Bush. who has been the Administration's face for Myanmar). While I liked Pelosi's statement about the continued detension of Aung San Suu Kyi, I think that a more forceful action should be undertaken by Congress (by both Democrats and Republicans) in the face of continued inaction by the Administration.
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| 56 | Mattinglyinthehall Dude
ID: 01629107 Thu, Jun 05, 2008, 11:28
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Boxman has an ally in The New Republic
Tough guy Mike Hendrix at the rabid right-wing Cold Fury thinks they're morons.
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