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Subject: Another Civil Rights violation by an NYC Cop Posted by: Tree - [3533298] Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 10:04 at least they didn't shoot him...granted, he's white, so he had that in his favor. still, this little display could have gotten the guy killed. | |||||||
| 1 | Seattle Zen Leader ID: 055343019 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 10:48 | What an ass. Aren't there some peaceful marijuana smokers around you need to throw in jail, a$$hole? | ||||||
| 2 | Tree ID: 3533298 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 11:13 |
oh yea.... and the guy who got shoved off his bike? Prosecutors say the cyclist, Christopher Long, was charged with blocking traffic, resisting arrest, disorderly conduct and assault. | ||||||
| 3 | sarge33rd ID: 99331714 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 13:23 |
How the fvck do they charge the cyclisy with assault?????? (or anything else for that matter???) Dayum do I see a lawsuit coming on this one. | ||||||
| 4 | biliruben ID: 52561217 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 13:32 |
Standard procedure for cops in any altercation is charging them with resisting arrest and disorderly conduct. The bicyclist was an army vet grocer. | ||||||
| 5 | Razor ID: 545172413 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 13:51 |
Blocking traffic charge is legit. Bicyclists should obey the rules of the road just like anyone else. But that was clearly a dispicable and unnecessary use of force. | ||||||
| 6 | sarge33rd ID: 99331714 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 13:52 | and what of the other 500+ cyclists???? (or however many there were) | ||||||
| 7 | Tree ID: 3533298 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 14:00 |
Blocking traffic charge is legit. Bicyclists should obey the rules of the road just like anyone else. compared to other cyclists there, he was hardly in the middle of the road. oh, and the rules of the road? the cyclist is entitled to that lane as much as you, in your automobile, is. if he's in front of you, taking up the entire lane, he is well within his right to do so. | ||||||
| 8 | Myboyjack Dude ID: 014826271 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 14:05 |
Critical Mass protests Police in New York have claimed that Critical Mass bicyclists corking intersections to allow the mass of bikes to pass may delay emergency vehicles unable to move in the gridlock.[14] Motorists driving cars on cross streets cannot practicably move over to the side of the streets in the way a bicyclist can due to the length and square footage of a car, and current traffic lane configurations on Manhattan streets which, at present, allow parking and driving of private automobiles in some areas. I don't think anyone is going to condone the violence the officer used to affect this arrest. It would appear that the officers were standing in the road in an attempt to stop the illegal protest and that the cyclists were buzzing right by them. How should the officer have made this arrest I wonder? He was obviosly giving the dude a stop command. Nice form on the body block, BTW. Power throught the hips. | ||||||
| 9 | Myboyjack Dude ID: 014826271 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 14:08 | tree - he and his fellow protestors were purposely violating the "rules of the road" - what do you think the cops were doing standing in the midlle of the road to begin with. | ||||||
| 10 | Perm Dude ID: 12614299 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 14:08 |
I don't know if you know anything about Critical Mass, but they intentionally follow the rules of the road, but on bikes. Some cyclists, however, do break traffic laws on the rides and should be properly cited. But a cyclist should not be treated differently from a motorist being charged with the same traffic violation. | ||||||
| 11 | sarge33rd ID: 99331714 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 14:08 |
Precisely right Tree. That bike is entitled to a lane, same as a motorcycle. IMHO, though obviously not a 'legal' opinion, that rider did nothing that could be termed obstructing traffic at all. The only reason he "changed lanes" w/o signaling first,w as to try and avoid a collison with the pedestrian (Officer) as said pedestrian approached his side. How about 'jay walking' charges against the Officer, along with assault and maybe 'wreckless endangerment'? (Knocking a cyclist off a moving bike and into the curb, could easily enough result in some pretty serious injury to that cyclist. (Skull bouncing off the curb for ex) Oh well, assuming no serious physical harm to the kid...I'm inclined to think he just got rich. | ||||||
| 12 | Myboyjack Dude ID: 014826271 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 14:11 |
Because Critical Mass takes place without an official route or sanction, participants practice a tactic known as "corking" in order to maintain the cohesion of the group. This tactic consists of a few riders blocking traffic from side roads so that the mass can freely proceed through red lights without interruption. Corking allows the mass to engage in a variety of activities, such as forming a cyclone, lifting their bikes in a tradition known as a "Bike Lift" (in Chicago this is referred to as a Chicago hold-up), or to perform a "die-in" where riders lie on the ground with their bikes to symbolise cyclist deaths and injuries caused by automobiles, very popular in Montreal. The 'Corks' sometimes take advantage of their time corking to distribute flyers. Critics argue that the practice of corking roads in order to pass through red lights as a group is contrary to Critical Mass' claim that "we are traffic", since ordinary traffic (including bicycle traffic) does not usually have the right to go through intersections once the traffic signal has changed to red, unless issued with a specific permit or residing in jurisdictions where bicyclists have this right such as in Idaho, where State law recognizes such riding.[17] (It should be noted that even in Idaho, cyclists are required to yield right of way if other traffic is present at stop signs and red lights, so corking remains a violation of Idaho law.) Corking has sometimes translated into hostility between motorists and riders, even erupting into violence and arrests of motorists and cyclists alike during Critical Mass rides.[18] [edit] Conflicts with | ||||||
| 13 | Razor ID: 545172413 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 14:21 | Critical Mass often blocks intersections for long periods of time, intentionally. They most certainly do not have a legal right to do this. | ||||||
| 14 | biliruben ID: 52561217 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 14:23 |
Bikers were corking here in Seattle yesterday, and a car decided to run over 2 bicyclists. He was dragged from his car and pummeled. Updated article - where he said he panicked. Portland has multiple instances of similar altercations, usually between bikers, one breaking the law, one trying to police their own. The obvious solution, short of banning cars (I can dream), is to improve the infrastructure so that bikes can ride safely, separate from car traffic. In NY, I envisioned turning one of the avenues car-free. It would multiply the bike riding populace 10-fold overnight, I would guess. I was a dare-devil when living there, but even I was a bit nervous about dueling with cabbies in Manhattan. | ||||||
| 15 | biliruben ID: 52561217 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 14:41 |
This is what we should aspire to.   
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| 16 | Myboyjack Dude ID: 014826271 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 14:45 | bili - I support those aims. I started biking the 7 miles to work last April on days the weather and my schedule allows. i'm lucky to have bike trails from close to my house into town; something we're trying to get more of here. | ||||||
| 17 | biliruben ID: 52561217 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 15:00 |
Sweet, MBJ! Good on ya. I have to admit that having a toddler has made it much harder to ride as often as I like. Dragging him around in traffic, on Seattle hills is daunting. Took him to daycare on bike on Friday, but I need to get a lighter trailer or move to a kid-seat if I'm going to ride hills. Ughh. I am now 5 minutes walk from work, so it's hard to maintain bike-shape, riding just on the weekends. | ||||||
| 18 | Tree ID: 3533298 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 15:42 |
what do you think the cops were doing standing in the midlle of the road to begin with. getting in the way of traffic. the fact is that cyclists have EVERY right to be on the road as the automobiles, provided they follow the same traffic rules. if a cyclist wants to be in the center of the lane, that's his right. In NY, I envisioned turning one of the avenues car-free. It would multiply the bike riding populace 10-fold overnight, I would guess. bili - they're actually doing this, to a limited degree. parts of 9th Ave now have separate bike lanes - and by that, i mean there is a curb or large barrier between the bike lane, and the car lanes.  they are starting to do it in other parts of the city as well, as narrowing car lanes is shown to decrease excess speed. | ||||||
| 19 | biliruben ID: 52561217 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 17:50 |
Cool, Tree! Last time was in town, I rented a bike for a quick peddle up the West Side bike trailly thingamabob, though not outrageously useful like, say closing Madison Ave to cars. A huge step forward for getting around the city, imho. I was waiting to get picked up to go to a wedding out on the island, so I happened to look a bit like this chappy: 
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| 20 | Boxman ID: 571114225 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 17:59 |
How about 'jay walking' charges against the Officer, along with assault and maybe 'wreckless endangerment'? (Knocking a cyclist off a moving bike and into the curb, could easily enough result in some pretty serious injury to that cyclist. (Skull bouncing off the curb for ex) Not to mention any bystanders on the sidewalk. | ||||||
| 21 | Texas Flood ID: 39642419 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 19:13 |
I can't help but wonder why that particular cyclist? Not necessarily defending the cop but I can't help but wonder what might have been said or done prior to flattening of the biker? If it was just a random attack by the cop he should certainly lose his job. Even if the guy did provoke the cop it could have been handled in a better manner. I'm sure this story will develop and we'll all be provided more information as time goes by. | ||||||
| 22 | biliruben ID: 52561217 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 19:26 | Watching, I just don't see how anything that bicyclist could have said would have been heard, and registered in time to respond. He was zeroing in on him well before anything offensive could have been comprehended, unless he was howling "fcuk cops" over and over again at the top of his lungs, or something. | ||||||
| 23 | biliruben ID: 52561217 Tue, Jul 29, 2008, 19:31 |
I think it's far more likely that the cop was planning to take out a biker when the light turned red, and that was the unlucky dude. It's impressive with what efficiency a fellow biker rescued his bike, never being foolish enough to get into it with the cops, realizing his bud was arrested, but saving his ride for him. | ||||||
| 24 | Tree ID: 6626305 Wed, Jul 30, 2008, 06:31 |
when people see videos like this, it enhances their distrust and lack of faith in the police. it doesn't help when you have total tools like the PBA (Police Union)President Patrick Lynch blindly defending the indefensible... The police union is coming to the defense of that officer. President Pat Lynch of the Patrolmen's Benevolent Association said Officer Patrick Pogan “took action” when he observed the rider creating a “hazardous situation for the public.” Lynch, who was unavailable for an on-camera interview, issued a statement saying the video shows the rider did not stop, like "any reasonable person" when approached by the officer. | ||||||
| 25 | sarge33rd ID: 99331714 Wed, Jul 30, 2008, 10:03 | Nor did the officer extend his arm, palm flat and fingers extended upward, to signal for the rider to stop, "as any reasonable officer would". | ||||||
| 26 | blue hen ID: 30311814 Wed, Jul 30, 2008, 10:11 |
I can't imagine a situation where the policeman should not lose his job. More likely, this should be jail time. Of course, the cop is more of an idiot for doing it in Times Square where there are a lot of tourists with cameras. | ||||||
| 27 | Perm Dude ID: 27639309 Wed, Jul 30, 2008, 10:45 |
NY Post story Rookie cop. Apparently someone in the locker room told them that he can project "stop" with just his mind... | ||||||
| 28 | Tree ID: 3533298 Wed, Jul 30, 2008, 11:24 |
BH - i agree. to me, this is assault/battery, plain and simple. and if it were not a cop, it could be stretched to attempted murder. it's also likely this will cost me, and the taxpayers of NYC, millions of dollars. while they're at it, they should think about sending his dad into retirement as well. from PD's linked story: "He's my son. I'm proud of him. He's third-generation that's been serving the city," said Pogan Sr., 51, who was at home in Massapequa Park, LI, yesterday and said he had not seen the video. "These people are taking over the streets and impeding the flow of traffic. Then you gotta do what you gotta do." um, no, you don't "gotta do what you gotta do". you're a cop - what you gotta do is follow the freakin' law. that cop lets that cyclist ride past, and likely, there is no incident. but by his actions, he has created a huge stir, and given the public another opportunity to question the people who are supposed to protect us. the son, should go to jail. the father, should retire. we don't need cops with that kind of attitude. | ||||||
| 29 | Seattle Zen ID: 49112418 Wed, Jul 30, 2008, 14:03 |
What a surprise, a douche bag whose rookie cop son is a son of a douche bag. What a surprise, a douche bag who just three weeks out of police academy has already been lying in his police reports. | ||||||
| 30 | Seattle Zen ID: 49112418 Wed, Jul 30, 2008, 18:48 |
This goes a long ways toward explaining police behavior. Police reject candidate for being too intelligent A US man has been rejected in his bid to become a police officer for scoring too high on an intelligence test. Robert Jordan, a 49-year-old college graduate, took an exam to join the New London police, in Connecticut, in 1996 and scored 33 points, the equivalent of an IQ of 125. But New London police interviewed only candidates who scored 20 to 27, on the theory that those who scored too high could get bored with police work and leave soon after undergoing costly training. | ||||||
| 31 | Seattle Zen ID: 49112418 Fri, Sep 05, 2008, 12:50 | Charges dropped against bicyclist | ||||||
| 32 | Seattle Zen ID: 49112418 Mon, Dec 15, 2008, 19:36 |
WOO HOO! Officer Is Indicted in Toppling of Cyclist David Rankin, a lawyer for the bicyclist, Christopher Long, said the office of the Manhattan district attorney, Robert M. Morgenthau, informed him around 3 p.m. that a grand jury had voted to indict Officer Pogan. Mr. London and Mr. Rankin both said they did not know the specific charges, and Mr. Morgenthau’s office declined to comment. It to jail for you, bitch! | ||||||
| 33 | Tree ID: 41371322 Thu, May 21, 2009, 10:18 |
5 Alabama police officers fired over beating caught on camera i'd have to say that this is a tough one. yes, the cops were wrong. absolutely in the wrong. but this is one of those cases where, as was said in the video, it is a very fine line. you can completely understand why the cops beat this guy. unfortunately, as cops, they can't do that. and that's the problem. | ||||||
| 34 | Mith ID: 2894309 Thu, May 21, 2009, 10:28 |
it is a very fine line No, it's not. It's thick and bold and clear and completely obvious. you can completely understand why the cops beat this guy Yes, because they failed in their responsibility as peace offices and allowed themselves to be overcome by their emotions. unfortunately, as cops, they can't do that unfortunately!? You would prefer police have the authority to use their desceretion for when severely beating an perp is acceptable procedure? | ||||||
| 35 | Tree ID: 41371322 Thu, May 21, 2009, 11:12 |
no MITH, that's not what i meant. my meaning was that as cops, they absolutely cannot cross that line, unless they want to lose their jobs. unfortunate, for THEM, that they did. unfortunate for their careers. i would think based on everything else i have ever said about police and beatings, the last thing i want to do is give them permission to beat folks when they want. | ||||||
| 36 | Mith ID: 2894309 Thu, May 21, 2009, 11:39 | Maybe I took you too literally but what am I supposed to think you mean by it is a very fine line? | ||||||
| 37 | Tree ID: 41371322 Thu, May 21, 2009, 12:10 |
i think it is a fine line. this was a guy who clearly tried to kill a cop a minute prior, steering toward him and running him down. in a split-second, adrenalin pumping, the guy gets thrown from the car, and the cops pounce, not knowing if he's got a gun or a knife or what he's going to do. instead, the guy is unconscious and limp, not moving. that's the line. if that guy gets up, and the cops tackle him to the ground and are forced to fight with him, i don't really see a problem. but the fact the dude was out cold, that's the problem. | ||||||
| 39 | Mith ID: 2894309 Thu, May 21, 2009, 12:41 |
The saying "a fine line" refers specifically to something that is difficult to classify as one thing or another, and the 'things' are usually the opposite of one anoter. My assumption was (and I think still is) that you feel this event falls on a fine line between acceptable and unacceptable police behavior. If that's your point, you're simply wrong. The line is as clearly defined as it could possibly be. If you were referring to some other "line", perhaps you could clue me in on what you're talking about. | ||||||
| 40 | tree, on the treo ID: 55220277 Thu, May 21, 2009, 13:10 |
the line is clearly defined, but as I've often said, its not a black and white world. in this case, the mitigating circumstances - violent offender, violent accident, 50 mile chase, attempted murder on a cop, and a split second reaction where they might not have even known the guy was out cold - make this a grey area. again. I'm among the last people to defend cops...and while this was a beating that crossed the line, this was no rodney king style beating either... | ||||||
| 41 | Boxman ID: 104121111 Thu, May 21, 2009, 13:31 |
Treetard: Go back to Texas. They are looking for you.
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| 42 | Mith ID: 2894309 Thu, May 21, 2009, 13:38 |
the mitigating circumstances ...make this a grey area. Make what a gray area? I'm sorry to nitpick but I really don't understand what you mean. You rely on these figures of speech that are supposed to describe the nature of the question at hand but what, exactly, is the question? Is the question of whether the behavior of the cops in the video is acceptable? If so, then no, it's not a gray area or a fine line or ambiguous or enigmatic or vague. | ||||||
| 43 | Mith ID: 2894309 Thu, May 21, 2009, 13:42 |
Moderators Can we at least change the image size in the troll post to make it a little less obnoxious? | ||||||
| 45 | Tree ID: 41371322 Thu, May 21, 2009, 17:00 |
Make what a gray area? I'm sorry to nitpick but I really don't understand what you mean. You rely on these figures of speech that are supposed to describe the nature of the question at hand but what, exactly, is the question? Is the question of whether the behavior of the cops in the video is acceptable? If so, then no, it's not a gray area or a fine line or ambiguous or enigmatic or vague. nothing in the video is acceptable. nothing we SEE there, is acceptable. my point is that we don't know yet, for example, for all we know, the cops weren't aware the guy was out cold, and thought he was getting ready to make a dash for and attack them. let me make it clear - the cops were wrong in that video. there may be more to the story, and what was going on in their minds in those miliseconds, but they were wrong. | ||||||
| 46 | Tree ID: 41371322 Fri, May 22, 2009, 08:22 |
as a follow up on the above story on the Birmingham cops... An attorney for five Birmingham police officers who were fired after being shown on videotape beating an inert suspect said Thursday they thought the man was conscious and armed. Attorney Gayle Gear said the officers who approached Anthony Warren had not seen him thrown from his van when it overturned at the end of a police chase, and they assumed he was a threat. Gear said the officers were following their training to force Warren to submit and they have appealed their dismissal to the Jefferson County Personnel Board. | ||||||
| 47 | Tree ID: 248472317 Thu, Apr 29, 2010, 18:16 |
just under 2 years later, ex-police officer Patrick Rogan is found guilty. unfortunately, it was not for assault. hopefully, he'll get some jail time anyway. | ||||||
| 48 | Seattle Zen ID: 1410391215 Thu, Apr 29, 2010, 19:01 |
Mr. Pogan faces up to four years in prison when he is formally sentenced. The jury in State Supreme Court in Manhattan reached a verdict in its third day of deliberations. Thanks for the update, Tree, good news. | ||||||
| 49 | Tree ID: 248472317 Wed, Jun 16, 2010, 09:46 |
Police Punches Woman On Tape In Jaywalking Incident while i'm not entirely unconvinced that the officer violated any civil rights, i do think it was an over-reaction on his part. | ||||||
| 50 | Tree ID: 17039238 Mon, Jul 23, 2012, 02:02 |
this is so bizarre. it doesn't even seem like it could be real. | ||||||
| 51 | Mith ID: 18451815 Mon, Jul 23, 2012, 02:14 |
The crowd had come out to protest police as they investigated a controversial shooting hours earlier in which an officer shot and killed someone. The protesters, which included children, encircled the investigators and began throwing bottles and rocks at them and set a dumpster on fire. They tried using rubber bullets to break up the crowd. The dog apparently got free in the commotion and attacked those people. It doesn't appear to have been commanded to attack them. Several officers including the dog's controller scrambled to pull it off. | ||||||
| 52 | Khahan ID: 39432178 Mon, Jul 23, 2012, 08:51 |
Tree, that video is certainly one I think anybody needs more info on before passing judgement. We never saw what led up to police opening fire on the residents of that community. And it certainly looked as if they were trying to pull the dog off, not commanding him to attack. If what MITH says is true then I think the cops are pretty justified in using rubber bullets and other non-lethal tactics. | ||||||
| 53 | Boldwin ID: 18643169 Mon, Jul 23, 2012, 13:58 | And those protesters should be darn happy the police had non-lethal tools at hand. Crowds coming at you with rocks is not something you can magnanimously ignore. | ||||||
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