RotoGuru Politics Forum

View the Forum Registry

XML Get RSS Feed for this thread


Self-edit this thread


0 Subject: DNC speeches

Posted by: Tree
- [2985318] Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:10

wow.

i'm 5 minutes into Guiliani's speech, and honestly, it's like watching a bad wrestling promo.

in wrestling, there are things called "cheap heat" and "cheap pops".

cheap heat is where you say something obvious, like, if you're a bad guy, and wrestling in Georgia, you say things to the crowd like "you dumb rednecks! i'm refined! i'm from hollywood! you georgia inbreds!"

cheap pops, are where you say something, obvious, like, if you're a good guy, and wrestling in Madison Square Garden, and you say "Hello New York!!!!"

Guiliani's speech, so far, is just cheap heat and cheap pops.
1Tree
      ID: 2985318
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:15
drill baby drill?

did i just end up at a high school football game?
2Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:20
Leaving content aside (if there is any) is he always this lousy of a speaker. He sounds and looks ill.
3Tree
      ID: 2985318
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:25
seriously. will anyone look at this speech and think it was good?

i feel like i'm watching someone running for senior class president.

(and what is this Sarah Palin is the most popular governor in the US talking point they keep going on with. a week ago, no one ever heard of her...how can she be the most popular?!?!)
4Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:28
80%+ approval rating in her state.

My 9 year old could read this speech off a teleprompter better than Rudy
5Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:29
Is that Cindy McCain holding the Palin baby? Creepy.
6Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:31
Well, she doesn't have to worry about having a hard act to follow...maybe that was the point of having Rudy's lame ass up there.
7Tree
      ID: 2985318
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:31
in her state. that doesn't mean much. it's one of the least populous states...
8Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:33
OK - but that's what they're referring to...I don't think they do polls on how popular governors are in other states.
9Tree
      ID: 2985318
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:39
world champion snow machine racer...

i mean...cool...but what does that have to do with the presidential race?
10Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:41
It is cool.
11astade
      ID: 1533770
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:44
wait. what happened?

I just saw a clip of a woman being escorted out of the arena while Palin was speaking. Anyone see it?
12Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:51
kook patrol
13Seward Norse
      ID: 58082219
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:57
Lots of crazies in Minnesota right now. Just busted a place that had gallons of urine saved up the other day.
14astade
      ID: 1533770
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:57
Thanks myboyjack...i turned away from the screen for one minute and i missed it :(

never met anyone from Alaska before but i notice her accent is very similar to a Canadian's. Reminds me of the tv show 'corner gas', anyone else see that great show?
15Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 22:58
Yeah, I was digging the accent.
16astade
      ID: 1533770
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 23:00
it's endearing to say the least...
17Seward Norse
      ID: 58082219
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 23:02
Maybe that's why I enjoy hearing her speak. It's like I'm back home. :)
18Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 23:02
She is the Sherriff from Fargo
19astade
      ID: 1533770
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 23:04
her daughter (albeit pregnant) looks eerily similar. now i can see why palin was a beauty pageant contestant...
20Seward Norse
      ID: 58082219
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 23:12
They call Palin's husband "The First Dude" in Alaska.
21astade
      ID: 1533770
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 23:14
anyone else consider if the ticket had been flipped (Palin-POTUS and McCain-VP) to mirror the democratic ticket how it would have played out?

They have a similar message but it sounds so much better from her than from mccain. regardless of the outcome of the election, i doubt this is the last we've heard of her.
22astade
      ID: 1533770
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 23:17
i love the black guy who was thrown in there during the Star Spangled Banner....perfect photo-op :)
23Seattle Zen
      ID: 8748191
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 23:21
Bush league. Really, bashing Community Organizers while touting being the chief piss ant in a tiny mound of piss ants? There are condominium boards that represent more people than Wasilla, AK.

Quick - "Who was Alf Landon's running mate?"

"Hell if I know."

Flash Forward 60 years: Who was John McCain's running mate.

"Who's John McCain?"

Right now I'd say Gov. Palin has a better chance of being on Dancing with the Stars than sitting through a morning meeting in the District of Columbia in the next four years.

Yeah, you got some yuks and cheers from your group of flunkies, but don't think for a minute that the few Americans who bothered to watch are buying your outright lies about Sen. Obama's record.
24astade
      ID: 1533770
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 23:24
SZ, so you don't think she answered one of the major questions....that she has the poise and the ability to take the gloves off and fight on a national level?
25Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 23:27
Zen - luv ya man - but as usual, you're politically tone deaf. If you don't think Palin's speech isn't going to resonate with the people they're trying to reach with her you'll never understand the 3/4 of America which you try so hard to ignore.

Aside from the fact that she stands in Obama's way, I don't get the immediate hatred on the Left for her. Sure she's conservative - but she's done a lot more to shake up the Republican cronyism already than Obama ever will.
26astade
      ID: 1533770
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 23:29
Another token appearance of a black man...the gent from Texas nominating McCain for president!
27Perm Dude
      ID: 51854214
      Wed, Sep 03, 2008, 23:48
MBJ: I haven't seen any "hatred" by the Left for Palin. None. A lot of questioning of her stances, qualifications, clarifications of things, and sharp questioning of her motives behind her politics, policies, and lack of experience. But until the definition of "hatred" is expanded to include all these things, I have to assume you are ascribing motives behind it all without there being any clear reason to.
28Boozer
      ID: 37462114
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 00:12
The little sheriff from Fargo has got some serious charisma, This is now going much more of a battle than I thought. She's bringing some much needed excitement to what I thought would be a very "boring" ticket with a whole lot of run of the mill talk and politics.

Thought it was a brilliant move when they announced her as the running mate. You have to admit she's going to get alot of those undecided man-haters, and she's going to lock down many of us who were could have leaned away from the party this time fearing more of the same.

The most effective speaker of both conventions in my opinion. Some great lines too. She reeled me back in.

group of flunkies?? wow
29Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 00:16
PD-You haven't been reading your Daily Kos, have you.
30Seattle Zen
      ID: 8748191
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 00:25
but she's done a lot more to shake up the Republican cronyism already than Obama ever will.

She hasn't done anything, MBJ. Well, other than trying to get some books banned in Wasilla, oh, and firing people she doesn't like anymore. She IS a crony.

I don't hate her anymore than I hated Alf Landon's running mate (still don't know who that was). Or Admiral Stockdale (man, I miss Phil Hartman) She is bush league and will not make a difference in this election. No, I'm not tone deaf. Sure, she'll fire up those who hate the Democrats, but she had their votes already.

You've got your numbers all wrong. Only 20% of this country is rural and that number is increasing as more and more city folk move into the rural West. I live amongst the 75% of the people whom you think I want to ignore and they are easily 60-40 in favor of Obama, and we're talking the whitest group of blue collar, high school educated folks around.

The battle lines have been drawn and McCain/Hockey Mom are on the wrong side of history. The country has become Democratic, the poll numbers for anything with the word Republican are abysmal. It's going to be 55/45 and I will never understand how 45% of this country could vote for John McCain.

PS: If anyone attempts to do Gov. Palin on SNL other than Tina Fey, I'll scream. Even if it requires them to have her guest host, has there ever been a better spitting image of a national office candidate as there is between Fey and Palin?
31Perm Dude
      ID: 51854214
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 00:30
MBJ: No, I haven't. DK is a little too content-free for my tastes.

I think the Republicans are trying to work up the base, even if it means more of the same attacks that we've seen. Certainly the base seems to really be caught up in the spirit (Messianic Sarah?). But energizing a smaller group of people to greater heights doesn't appear to be a recipe for a W for the GOP. Registered Democrats outnumber registered Republicans by a lot nowadays.

Palin became what a VP candidate should: an attack dog for her side. It'll be interesting to see how Biden responds (I don't expect Obama to really respond much himself--by ignoring her it'll make her direct attacks on him just hang in the air looking silly).
32Kyle
      Donor
      ID: 052753312
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 00:49
PS: If anyone attempts to do Gov. Palin on SNL other than Tina Fey, I'll scream. Even if it requires them to have her guest host, has there ever been a better spitting image of a national office candidate as there is between Fey and Palin?

I really think she even sounds like Tina Fey. If I still watched SNL (which I may restart, just to see who does who in this election) I would be extremely upset if it wasn't Fey.

I think Palin did a good job on attacking Obama, something I don't think the Left did during their convention. Obama only resorted to the same attacks of every republican. "Oh no, he's the same party as Bush! That's horrible. He voted with Bush on 95% of the bills in the senate." Obama also voted with his party 99% of the time. Does that mean the dems were right 99% of the time while the republicans were wrong 95% of the time?

I actually heard someone say that Palin has been in office as long as Obama has run his campaign. Is that supposed to bad for Palin and good for Obama? That just means that Obama hasn't been doing his job the last 20 months, by being on the road campaigning. McCain has done the same thing, but still is that supposed to be a knock on Palin? I think that more discredits Obama and McCain and not the running mates.
33Perm Dude
      ID: 51854214
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 01:09
Obama was refutting McCain's "maverick" credentials by pointing out that McCain doesn't often vote against his party after all. And tying him to an incredibly unpopular President seems fitting as well.

Palin is a pick which seriously undercuts McCain's argument that accumulated electoral experience matters a great deal in this election. She has even less experience than Obama, and none on the federal level.
34Razor
      ID: 4682040
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 01:29
Didn't have access to watch this speech, but I am going to respond to a couple of things:

She criticized Obama's stance on Iraq, saying he "wants to forfeit" while victory is "finally in sight."

Really? Where? When? How? What does victory even mean? There is no victory left to be had in this war, is there? Victory to most Americans, I would guess, means getting Iraq to the point where we can finally get the hell out of there without it collapsing.

"What exactly is our opponent's plan? What does he actually seek to accomplish after he's done turning back the waters and healing the planet? The answer is to make the government bigger and take more of your money."

My guess is that as of 10 days ago, Palin was roughly equally well-versed on the plans of McCain and Obama, which is to say, she wasn't well-versed in either.

I don't think Obama has been unclear in saying that he wants to lower taxes for most Americans and reduce government inefficiencies. Irony #1 of the night was the GOP talking about bloated government while Bush has ballooned the deficit to levels never before seen.

Palin, whose youngest child has Down syndrome, also promised that families of special needs children will have "a friend and advocate in the White House."

More governmental assistance for children with Down syndrome?

"Zero! Zero!"

Irony #2.


I think it's hilarious that Palin takes on Obama by presenting herself as a reformer from outside Washington who feels her scant experience is sufficient to deliver on her promises.
35Baldwin
      ID: 24841319
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 05:04
Razor

Are Obama supporters even allowed to bring up experience as an issue?
36Baldwin
      ID: 24841319
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 05:15
Obama was refutting McCain's "maverick" credentials by pointing out that McCain doesn't often vote against his party after all. - PD

Then why has be been so carefully nurtured by the NYT all these years? If elected I think one of his planks is to never miss a soiree thrown by the editor of the WP.
37Razor
      ID: 3585945
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 07:00
Are Obama supporters even allowed to bring up experience as an issue?

This is an argument that began on the right, but apparently think is still valied even after McCain selected Palin who is as unqualified a VP candidate as I've seen in my lifetime. It's obvious that McCain and his supporters do not think experience is as big of an issue as they have previously made it out to be. Palin should be the last person to call out Obama on his relative lack of experience. But I suppose irony and hypocrisy are foreign concepts to Republicans after seeing the 2004 RNC where Kerry's military service was mocked and Bush was declared most fit to lead the country in a time of war. These last couple of RNC's border on absurdity.
38Tree
      ID: 3085645
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 07:00
AP article on Palin's speech...

a bit of fact checking from the AP, and truth stretching from the GOP..

last night struck me as a lot of rah rah speech by the football coach at a high school pep rally.

that's fine for her base. but if that speech resonates any further than that, Americans will prove to me we're even more stupid than we were for re-electing Bush the Lesser.
39Pancho Villa
      ID: 51546319
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 09:07
"There is only one man in this election who has ever really fought for you in places where winning means survival and defeat means death — and that man is John McCain," said Palin.

So, in Vietnam. winning meant survival and defeat meant death?

Can anyone please explain how bombing Hanoi was in any way connected with the national security of the United States? She might just as well have said,

"I'm a fervent supporter of the military industrial complex and am willing to distort historical events in the hope that future US military actions around he world will not be scutinized by its citizens."

Then there's the embarrassing statement by my governor,

Jon Huntsman.

"I love when people say she has no national-security experience, no foreign-policy experience," Huntsman told Utah delegates to the Republican National Convention. "The state borders Russia and Canada, for heaven's sake."

Sadly, he wasn't joking.
40Tree
      ID: 13714198
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 09:25
PV - there was actually a news commentator (on Fox, i believe), who made the same statement about Palin, Alaska, and Russia.
41Perm Dude
      ID: 2784948
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 09:52
#36: Whether this label is "nurtured" by the NYT or not is moot. It has been nurtured by McCain, who continues to use it as a reason to vote for him. Whether a compliant media went along with it for years misses the point that McCain himself draws upon the label to try to gather votes. Which makes the label is legitimate target by Obama.
42Madman
      ID: 230542010
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 14:59
apparently think is still valied even after McCain selected Palin who is as unqualified a VP candidate as I've seen in my lifetime. John Edwards?

I also don't understand the Palin's totally unqualified and therefore people can't talk about how Obama's unqualified ... Veep qualifications aren't the same as Presidential ones, at least not historically ... Palin hammered this head-on in her speech when she went through activity/accomplishment that she's been involved with over the past 6 years, highlighting her activities with the O&GC and as Chief Executive. Even just two $10+ billion budgets, and even just one $40b pipeline project (praised by Obama) add up to something meaningful. I think people are confusing experience with familiarity.
43Perm Dude
      ID: 21822410
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 15:06
I think you might be right, Madman. But mostly I see people attacking McCain's argument of insisting that her limited time as Governor outweighs Obama's experience, values, and so on for the job of President.

If the GOP wants to argue that Palin meets the very nominal qualifications for office of the Vice Presidency I don't think you'd get much argument. But they aren't making that point.
44Tree
      ID: 13714198
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 15:08
i'm also meaning to go back and see what she said about Obama and Israel, in relation to what he actually said.

all i've seen from Obama is unqualified support for Israel. But Palin seemed to indicate otherwise, to the point of all but calling him a liar.
45biliruben
      ID: 38751812
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 15:10
Regarding Palin's qualifications, I will just agree with Noonan and Murphy and leave it at that:

"It's over," said Noonan, who then responded to a question of whether Palin is the most qualified Republican woman McCain could have chosen.

"The most qualified? No. I think they went for this — excuse me — political bullshit about narratives," she said. "Every time the Republicans do that, because that's not where they live and it's not what they're good at, they blow it."

Murphy chimed in:

"The greatness of McCain is no cynicism, and this is cynical."
46Tree
      ID: 13714198
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 15:45
damn bili, stealing my post from last night. that news is SO yesterday.

personally, i'm realizing i prefer Palin from the 80s...



and


hey! what's he doing here???
47biliruben
      ID: 38751812
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 15:48
Sorry, it just rang so true, and summed up my feelings so well.

I don't often have a meeting of the minds with Peggy Noonan.

BTW, I got twittered by a treesham. I feel so violated.
48Seattle Zen
      ID: 49112418
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 19:41
Here's a speech by a reporter. I can't quite tell if this report came from Beijing during the Olympics or from St. Paul during the RNC, with all the riot gear and inhuman behavior...

Who is checking the Kook Patrol for kooks?

As the Republican National Convention meets in St. Paul, Minn., this week, police are systematically targeting journalists. I was arrested with my two colleagues, Democracy Now! producers Sharif Abdel Kouddous and Nicole Salazar, while reporting on the first day of the RNC.
It was Labor Day, and there was an anti-war march, with a huge turnout, with local families, students, veterans and people from around the country gathered to oppose the war. The protesters greatly outnumbered the Republican delegates.

There was a positive, festive feeling, coupled with a growing anxiety about the course that Hurricane Gustav was taking, and whether New Orleans would be devastated anew. Later in the day, there was a splinter march. The police -- clad in full body armor, with helmets, face shields, batons and canisters of pepper spray -- charged. They forced marchers, onlookers and working journalists into a nearby parking lot, then surrounded the people and began handcuffing them.

Nicole was videotaping. Her tape of her own violent arrest is chilling. Police in riot gear charged her, yelling, "Get down on your face." You hear her voice, clearly and repeatedly announcing "Press! Press! Where are we supposed to go?" She was trapped between parked cars. The camera drops to the pavement amidst Nicole's screams of pain. Her face was smashed into the pavement, and she was bleeding from the nose, with the heavy officer with a boot or knee on her back. Another officer was pulling on her leg. Sharif was thrown up against the wall and kicked in the chest, and he was bleeding from his arm.

I was at the Xcel Center on the convention floor, interviewing delegates. I had just made it to the Minnesota delegation when I got a call on my cell phone with news that Sharif and Nicole were being bloody arrested, in every sense. Filmmaker Rick Rowley of Big Noise Films and I raced on foot to the scene. Out of breath, we arrived at the parking lot. I went up to the line of riot police and asked to speak to a commanding officer, saying that they had arrested accredited journalists.

Within seconds, they grabbed me, pulled me behind the police line and forcibly twisted my arms behind my back and handcuffed me, the rigid plastic cuffs digging into my wrists. I saw Sharif, his arm bloody, his credentials hanging from his neck. I repeated we were accredited journalists, whereupon a Secret Service agent came over and ripped my convention credential from my neck. I was taken to the St. Paul police garage where cages were set up for protesters. I was charged with obstruction of a peace officer. Nicole and Sharif were taken to jail, facing riot charges.

The Republicans say they hate trial attorneys, yet they are certainly going to enrich many of them with police riots like this. It's simply amazing that brutal attacks by police such as these are not responded with violence like you see in many other countries. Pathetic, pin headed twits not worthy of a badge embarrass this country.
49Tree
      ID: 23843418
      Thu, Sep 04, 2008, 19:49
i strongly believe this is the way of the future, if we continue to allow the radical elements of the right to run our country. Sarah Palin scares the f*ck out of me.

if somehow she and Mccain win, she's president within 2 years. i think see her waging war against muslims, and against any other non-christians.
51Perm Dude
      ID: 22824415
      Fri, Sep 05, 2008, 13:16
RNC tech guys mixup responsible for the green screen?
52Building 7
      ID: 174591519
      Fri, Sep 05, 2008, 21:55
if somehow she and Mccain win, she's president within 2 years.

I'm not sure what happens to McCane ....but if I thought that was going to happen, I might actually vote for this ticket.
53Perm Dude
      ID: 22824415
      Fri, Sep 05, 2008, 23:36
Maybe a little elitism would have helped here:

54Seattle Zen
      ID: 358591721
      Fri, Sep 19, 2008, 17:41
RE post 48:

Charges Against Journalists at RNC Dropped; Questions Remain
Nearly two dozen reporters were arrested during the four-day event, including Democracy Now! host Amy Goodman and two of her producers, Associated Press reporters, student journalists, and local TV photographers, among others. Other journalists were pepper-sprayed, and reporters with I-Witness were held at gunpoint during a "pre-emptive" police raid aimed at disrupting protesters. The press release from St. Paul Mayor Chris Coleman's office noted that the city's attorney will use a "broad definition and verification to identify journalists who were caught up in mass arrests during the convention."

"We’re pleased that the St. Paul authorities ultimately acted to uphold the rights of all journalists -- including those citizens using blogs, cheap cameras and cell phones to report news as it happens," said Josh Silver, executive director of Free Press, the national media reform organization. "Our task now is to ensure that our press remains free to report on the events, issues and stories that matter to our country, our communities, and our democracy."

"This is an important first step, but many questions remain," said Nancy Doyle Brown from Twin Cities Media Alliance. "We still need answers about why and how journalists got swept up in these arrests in the first place. And more than anything else, we need to ensure that this never happens again. We’ll never know how many important stories never got told because their authors were behind bars, not in the streets."
55Boldwin
      ID: 9820164
      Fri, Sep 19, 2008, 17:47
That's just a little extra backbone, PD.
 If you believe a recent post violates the policy on Civility and Respect,
you may report the abuse via email to moderators@rotoguru1.com 
RotoGuru Politics Forum

View the Forum Registry

XML Get RSS Feed for this thread


Self-edit this thread




Post a reply to this message: (But first, how about checking out this sponsor?)

Name:
Email:
Message:
Click here to create and insert a link
Click here to insert a block of hidden (spoiler) text
Ignore line feeds? no (typical)   yes (for HTML table input)


Viewing statistics for this thread
Period# Views# Users
Last hour11
Last 24 hours11
Last 7 days33
Last 30 days1411
Since Mar 1, 20071599740