RotoGuru Politics Forum

View the Forum Registry

XML Get RSS Feed for this thread


Self-edit this thread


0 Subject: Benghazi

Posted by: Boldwin
- [33933290] Mon, Oct 29, 2012, 12:59

The other social media war.
Only the 50 most recent replies are currently shown. Click on this text to display hidden posts as well.
[Lengthy or complex threads may require a slight delay before updating.]
378Boldwin
      ID: 2446204
      Mon, May 20, 2013, 06:29
The most likely suspect for organizer of the Benghazi attack is Libyan terror leader Abu Sufian bin Qumu.

Abu Sufian bin Qumu was sprung from Gitmo by White House visitor Hisham Y. Altalib.

Hisham Y. Altalib's other activities include working with Al Taqwa Bank laundering money for a plethora of violent Muslim terrorist groups and various initiatives to conquer America through Islamic propagandizing.

Naturally the administration actions make no sense from a traditional pro-American POV.
379Boldwin
      ID: 414282020
      Mon, May 20, 2013, 22:20
According to a source no one here will buy, but at least consider this a heads up...

"Retired 4 Star Admiral James Lyons reveals the entire plot that led to the deaths of Americans in Libya that could have been prevented"

He calls it a botched October Surprise that went wrong when forces ordered to stand down went to the rescue.

Supposedly Obama was going to rescue - ransom the ambassador for the Blind Sheik. This would give Obama the excuse to do what he wanted to do anyway with the Blind Sheik and come out smelling like a rose delivering the ambassador from the clutches...just in time for the election.

Enraged al qaeda did not take kindly to having the cake-walk of a plot turn into a shooting gallery on them.
380Boldwin
      ID: 4429213
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 04:39
There is a CIA source claiming there is a shoe about to drop that the WH is freaking out about and holding their breath over. That Lyon stuff looks pretty damaging, but the whispers were more along the lines of the media spying being far far worse than so far revealed. The media which they dare not set on permanent outrage mode.
381Boldwin
      ID: 4429213
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 04:53
World class spin. This piece from CBS tries to reduce the damaging actions to a state department spokesman who used to work for Dick Cheney! It's not even Bush's fault, it's indirectly Dick Cheney's fault!

Hilarious. I put it down to an effort to bamboozle liberals into dismissing the whole thing cause they can't possibly believe anyone else would buy this. At least keep your own people pacified while you dodge the steely-eyed people.
382Boldwin
      ID: 4429213
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 06:42
The administration's 'doctored emails defense'.

All this is based on the way the emails were first released. They were revealed to congressmen who were not allowed to make copies but could only take notes.

In one place the notetaker indicated this part was refering to the State Dept which it clearly was. The State Dept was clearly the party most actively interested in A@@covering. The email did not explicitly state this however at that point.

Then the reporters who got the notes, several people's notes were used by various reporters, included the parenthetical phrase [State Dept] as if it had been explicitly part of the email.

That in a nutshell is the defense. Reporters and the GOP had to doctor the emails.

But no, the admin deliberately hobbled the first release of the emails and so the release was imperfect.
n other words, the summary would have been fairly close if the commas had been removed and replaced with brackets: “We must make sure that the talking points reflect all agency equities [including those of the State Department] and we don’t want to undermine the FBI investigation.”

It has long been part of the Washington game for officials to discredit a news story by playing up errors in a relatively small part of it. Pfeiffer gives the impression that GOP operatives deliberately tried to “smear the president” with false, doctored e-mails.

But the reporters involved have indicated they were told by their sources that these were summaries, taken from notes of e-mails that could not be kept. The fact that slightly different versions of the e-mails were reported by different journalists suggests there were different note-takers as well.

Indeed, Republicans would have been foolish to seriously doctor e-mails that the White House at any moment could have released (and eventually did).
There is a clever trick to remember the rest of your political researcher career.

An admin without an ace to play can invent one by deliberately introducing static into the stream of information and then waving their arms over their own created confusion they themselves created.

All 'the most transparent administration in history' had to do was actually be transparent and release the emails for copying. There was no media malfeasance or political agenda at work in this instance.
383Khahan
      ID: 39432178
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 09:42
So Boldwin, refresh my memory here - what exactly is the charge in benghazi?
Is it that the obama administration had a hand in the riots?

Is it that they willfully and deliberately did nothing about the riots, expecting this to happen?

or did they maybe just have imperfect information and didn't make the best decision?

I'll be honest, right now my concern is not with their response after it all went down. My concern is not with emails. Not with labels put on it after the fact. Right now my concern is with the Benghazi situation itself. What exactly transpired that day, involving the Obama administration, to make all the other stuff matter (or even need to be looked at)?
384Mith
      ID: 4310402110
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 12:11
A pretty good clue it's long past time to give it up already.
385Biliruben
      ID: 358252515
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 12:37
Heh. This is what I mean by marginalizing the nut jobs. If you give them enough rope, they do it to themselves.

Hopefully we can start to govern again; sooner rather than later.
386Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 14:38
This is why the GOP can't have nice things.

The piece is more wide-ranging than Benghazi, but it seems pretty right-on when it comes to Benghazi, particularly this line:

"Seriously, conservatives need to wake up and realize that Benghazi just isn’t the scandal they so desperately want it to be."
387Boldwin
      ID: 164192113
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 16:45
Khahan

1) The ambassador was arming al qaeda. The public would be somewhat non-plussed to learn that the USA was in the business of turning al qaeda into a nation changing world power.

2) Clinton cut out the State Department's own counter-terrorism bureau from the loop in this situation, kept them in the dark. Did not seek their counsel.

3) They told ready willing and able resources to stand down and do nothing as a terrorist attack was ongoing for half a day.

4) While they watched.
388Boldwin
      ID: 164192113
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 16:52
Khahan

It's like the Bush administration's response to islamic terrorism in reverse.

Imagine if Bush had the goal of putting the taliban in power in Afghanistan and was arming them. Further imagine that he was aware of the 9/11 plot as it unfolded and he deliberately cut out the intelligence services and told the military to stand down.
389Boldwin
      ID: 164192113
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 16:58
While he watched with his drone.
390Tree
      ID: 59451219
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 17:35
1) The ambassador was arming al qaeda. The public would be somewhat non-plussed to learn that the USA was in the business of turning al qaeda into a nation changing world power.

like you, in regards to the GIANT role Reagan played in that exact issue?
391Boldwin
      ID: 164192113
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 19:26
Those people who were able to foresee al qaeda's future plans would indeed have some answering to do.
392Tree
      ID: 564211423
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 19:55
the point here is how quickly you are to blame those you are opposed to politically, and how equally quickly you are deflect similar criticism of those you worship.
393Boldwin
      ID: 164192113
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 20:27
I do not deflect criticism from the CFR that I don't doubt has had this whole thing scripted since way before Reagan.

Way back then, 'The enemy of my enemy is my friend' was a perfectly reasonable suggestion, to anyone who wasn't an expert in Muslim end-time theology at the time. Anyone who was well aware of that at the time, and recommended embracing al qaeda should not be guiding anyone then or now.
394Mith
      ID: 29182720
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 20:45
McCain/Feingold?
395sarge33rd
      ID: 4609710
      Tue, May 21, 2013, 22:34
"Muslim end time theology".

May I suggest, you listen less to alarmists, open your mind (difficult as it may be), and read both the Koran AND the Bible. Afterwards, you tell me which is the more violent and vicious.
396Boldwin
      ID: 14427221
      Wed, May 22, 2013, 02:33
1) I have

2) Easy. The one that says 'Put away your sword, he who lives by the sword dies by the sword' is peaceful and the one that says 'Kill the infidel wherever you may find him' is the vicious one. Even if you personally did not follow that advice.

3) How dare you call yourself a christian while defaming Christianity at every opportunity. You are insulting God and the intelligence of your listeners.
397Tree
      ID: 564211423
      Wed, May 22, 2013, 10:38
i believe point 3 in 396 above was self-reflective? are you talking to yourself again Baldwin?

you don't necessarily defame Christianity in your words, but you sure do in your actions and your beliefs.
398Boldwin
      ID: 384162217
      Thu, May 23, 2013, 07:03
Five of the Benghazi terrorists and their whereabouts are known and Obama won't have them arrested.
399Mith
      ID: 412561115
      Thu, May 23, 2013, 08:27
He hasn't read the Koran. He's read Koran passages that he has been directed to by people with a vested interest in convincing others to hate and distrust Muslims.

Just like he hasn't read the AP article about the identified Benghazi suspects that the link in #398 describes. He simply read (and linked, gee thanks) an item that tells you what some of the information in the AP article means - from the perspective of someone with a vested interest in convincing others to hate and distrust the president of the United States.

Of course he has all his facts straight. Why wouldn't he?

Did you know Trayvon Martin was 2/3 of the way to some fine a@@ drank when he snuck up on and attacked George Zimmerman?
400Tree
      ID: 564211423
      Thu, May 23, 2013, 10:11
Did you know Trayvon Martin was 2/3 of the way to some fine a@@ drank when he snuck up on and attacked George Zimmerman?

he was just a chemistry degree away. or at least a bottle of 'tussin...tussin...tussin...
401Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Tue, May 28, 2013, 21:11
Was Obama high on coke during the Benghazi attack?

Examiner briefly posts, then pulls, right wing nutter theory.
402Mith
      ID: 29182720
      Wed, May 29, 2013, 07:15
From the Unskewed Polls guy that Republicans latched onto last fall as the savior who had figured out why all the polls (that turned out to be exactly right) were biased and posted "fixed" versions of them that just happened to show that Romney would win in a landslide. Haha I love that guy!
403Boldwin
      ID: 32532618
      Thu, Jun 06, 2013, 23:33
On Wednesday, military veterans and retired special operations officers demanded, in an open letter released by OPSEC, that former Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Admiral Mike Mullen be deposed by Congress. The reason they are making the demand is to find out why U.S. forces were not ordered to rescue the four American men who were under attack and died in Benghazi, Libya on September 11, 2012.
-“Why does your report include no mention whatsoever of requests for military assistance made by the U.S. Deputy Chief of Mission in Libya which he has testified he made and which were denied?”

-“Your report states that you found “no evidence of…denial of support from Washington or the combatant commands.” That finding is in direct conflict with sworn testimony by DCM Hicks that a Special Operations team was denied permission to fly to Benghazi to assist in the response to the attack. Why did your report fail to account for that incident?

-“The report finds that any military response could not have reached Benghazi in time to save lives but that was not possible to know at the time of the attack when requests for assistance – requests not included in your report – were denied. Why do you believe those requests should have been denied when Americans were still under armed attack?”
404Boldwin
      ID: 25111019
      Mon, Jun 10, 2013, 20:41
Scandal of the week defense.
Benghazi, however, is the one scandal he cannot blame on anyone other than himself. Barack Obama was Commander in Chief during the Benghazi attack. It was he alone who could have issued the orders for our special forces to stand down and let our ambassador and three other Americans be slaughtered.
405Mith
      ID: 231150292
      Sun, Dec 29, 2013, 03:51
The right's remaining talking points on Bengazi collapse
Months of investigation by The New York Times, centered on extensive interviews with Libyans in Benghazi who had direct knowledge of the attack there and its context, turned up no evidence that Al Qaeda or other international terrorist groups had any role in the assault. The attack was led, instead, by fighters who had benefited directly from NATO’s extensive air power and logistics support during the uprising against Colonel Qaddafi. And contrary to claims by some members of Congress, it was fueled in large part by anger at an American-made video denigrating Islam.


Fifteen months after Mr. Stevens’s death, the question of responsibility remains a searing issue in Washington, framed by two contradictory story lines.

One has it that the video, which was posted on YouTube, inspired spontaneous street protests that got out of hand. This version, based on early intelligence reports, was initially offered publicly by Susan E. Rice, who is now Mr. Obama’s national security adviser.

The other, favored by Republicans, holds that Mr. Stevens died in a carefully planned assault by Al Qaeda to mark the anniversary of its strike on the United States 11 years before. Republicans have accused the Obama administration of covering up evidence of Al Qaeda’s role to avoid undermining the president’s claim that the group has been decimated, in part because of the raid that killed Osama bin Laden.

The investigation by The Times shows that the reality in Benghazi was different, and murkier, than either of those story lines suggests. Benghazi was not infiltrated by Al Qaeda, but nonetheless contained grave local threats to American interests. The attack does not appear to have been meticulously planned, but neither was it spontaneous or without warning signs.

Mr. Abu Khattala had become well known in Benghazi for his role in the killing of a rebel general, and then for declaring that his fellow Islamists were insufficiently committed to theocracy. He made no secret of his readiness to use violence against Western interests. One of his allies, the leader of Benghazi’s most overtly anti-Western militia, Ansar al-Shariah, boasted a few months before the attack that his fighters could “flatten” the American Mission. Surveillance of the American compound appears to have been underway at least 12 hours before the assault started.

The violence, though, also had spontaneous elements. Anger at the video motivated the initial attack. Dozens of people joined in, some of them provoked by the video and others responding to fast-spreading false rumors that guards inside the American compound had shot Libyan protesters. Looters and arsonists, without any sign of a plan, were the ones who ravaged the compound after the initial attack, according to more than a dozen Libyan witnesses as well as many American officials who have viewed the footage from security cameras.
406Boldwin
      ID: 2246117
      Fri, May 02, 2014, 07:05
Your tax dollars at work. Since Obama decided to back al qeada in Syria we should see what we are getting for our money.
407Boldwin
      ID: 585281717
      Wed, Jun 18, 2014, 00:33
You heard it here first. I have not read this take anywhere.

What is actually going on with the 'capture of the Benghazi mastermind.'

1) Why now? They've known about him all along. The terrorists called him on State Dept cellphones they picked up at the scene of the crime.

This is 'wag the dog'. This is Clinton's bombing of the pill factory to distract from Monica, redux for Iraq/Benghazi hearings/IRS hearings, etc, redone with an extra twist.

2) Now that Obama's managed to establish a precedent of just turning key terrorists free without getting impeached and without obeying the law...

...they have just offered him the deal to testify falsely to get Hillary off the hook on the phony 'slanderous video was the cause' and they'll set him free before long. With Hillary's deck clean for the election.
408Perm Dude
      ID: 294531914
      Wed, Jun 18, 2014, 09:24
This just in: "Obama cures cancer! FOX questions the fact that he used a TelePrompter in making announcement..."
409Boldwin
      ID: 395291810
      Wed, Jun 18, 2014, 12:01
I predict he is free before the video maker.
410Boldwin
      ID: 395291810
      Wed, Jun 18, 2014, 12:02
They'll prolly trade him for the three Israeli kids just kidnapped or something like that.
411Tree
      ID: 438482411
      Wed, Jun 18, 2014, 19:31
410 is about as clueless as it gets, and shows a dramatic ignorance for..well...a lot of things.

for starters, Hamas would unlikely accept a deal like that. it took 1,027 freed terrorist to get Gilad Shalit released.

it also shows a woeful misunderstanding about prisoner exchanges through out history, including exchanges the United States did with North Korea and Nazi Germany.
412sarge33rd
      ID: 390471112
      Fri, Jul 11, 2014, 02:21
There was no order to "stand down"

Others, such as Issa and Rep. Jason Chaffetz of Utah, have said a stand down order was given.

"We had proximity, we had capability, we had four individuals in Libya armed, ready to go, dressed, about to get into the car to go in the airport to go help their fellow countrymen who were dying and being killed and under attack in Benghazi, and they were told to stand down," Chaffetz said more than a year ago. "That's as sickening and depressing and disgusting as anything I have seen. That is not the American way."

Beyond questions of timing, the testimony of Rear Adm. Brian Losey, who was then Special Operations commander for Africa, also challenged the idea the team had the capacity to bolster security in Benghazi.

Losey said there was "never an order to stand down." His instruction to the team "was to remain in place and continue to provide security in Tripoli because of the uncertain environment." Earlier on Sept. 11, the U.S. Embassy in Cairo had been breached as well.


Doesnt fit well with the GOP narrative, but then over the past dozen or so years, not very much has.
413Boldwin
      ID: 216341110
      Fri, Jul 11, 2014, 11:44
There were plenty of assets ready and plenty of marines with a rescue 'leave no one behind ethos' eager to help and we notice they did not get deployed.

We know that General Ham was retired for his disagreement with Benghazi inaction. It is believed that a high level Navy Officer [an admiral?] was relieved over the same issue.

Also we know the special forces on the scene in Benghazi were ordered to stand down and not go rescue the ambassador.

If your accertion is that no one was ordered to stand down, where were their actions, then?
414sarge33rd
      ID: 86541113
      Fri, Jul 11, 2014, 14:54
Also we know the special forces on the scene in Benghazi were ordered to stand down and not go rescue the ambassador.

If your accertion is that no one was ordered to stand down, where were their actions, then?


To address your first line first;

no, they were not ordered to stand down. There was no such order issued.

As for your second line. Here, you prove beyond any doubt, how little you know about military ops. Assets must be ordered into action, They do not go into action, absent an order to do so. There was no such order, as is explained in the link I provided above.
415Boldwin
      ID: 216341110
      Fri, Jul 11, 2014, 18:17
I notice you only mentioned the officers who didn't put their jobs on the line disagreeing with the stand down order.
416Boldwin
      ID: 216341110
      Fri, Jul 11, 2014, 18:19
Obama has pruned the armed forces leadership of principled people and filled their slots with Shinseki's.
417sarge33rd
      ID: 86541113
      Fri, Jul 11, 2014, 19:46
Please regale us Boldwin, with your extensive resume which grants you so much insight into the operations of the US Military...

go ahead, you have the floor;
418Boldwin
      ID: 216341110
      Fri, Jul 11, 2014, 23:47
It's a simple job even you can handle. Google Obama purges military.
419sarge33rd
      ID: 390471112
      Fri, Jul 11, 2014, 23:53
so, RWNJ bolgs are your source? Infowars, breitbart, theblaze...THOSE are the training grounds for your extensive military expertise.

Pardon me, while I laugh you off the planet.
420Boldwin
      ID: 216341110
      Sat, Jul 12, 2014, 00:07
189,000 results

Keep researching.
421Tree
      ID: 438482411
      Sat, Jul 12, 2014, 12:36
Google Obama purges military.

189,000 results


Google jehovah's witnesses touch kids

1,900,000 results.

are you implying that with many results, the truth can actually be found?

good to know.
422sarge33rd
      ID: 390471112
      Sun, Aug 03, 2014, 20:10
After a 2 year investigation, House Panel concludes there waas NO Administration wrong doing....

The panel voted Thursday to declassify the report, the result of two years of investigation by the committee. U.S. intelligence agencies will have to approve making the report public.

Thompson said the report "confirms that no one was deliberately misled, no military assets were withheld and no stand-down order (to U.S. forces) was given."

That conflicts with accusations of administration wrongdoing voiced by Rep. Darrell Issa, R-Vista (San Diego County), whose House Government Oversight and Reform Committee has held hearings on the Benghazi attack.

Stevens, who grew up in Piedmont, and the other Americans died when Libyans attacked the consulate on Sept. 11, 2012. Among the Intelligence Committee's findings, according to Thompson:

-- Intelligence agencies were "warned about an increased threat environment, but did not have specific tactical warning of an attack before it happened."

-- "A mixed group of individuals, including those associated with al Qaeda, (Moammar) Khadafy loyalists and other Libyan militias, participated in the attack."

-- "There was no 'stand-down order' given to American personnel attempting to offer assistance that evening, no illegal activity or illegal arms transfers occurring by U.S. personnel in Benghazi, and no American was left behind."


I know B, you were SO rooting for America to have failed........
423Perm Dude
      ID: 586411123
      Sun, Aug 03, 2014, 20:56
The report is clearly only being released to distract from Benghazi.
424Perm Dude
      ID: 586411123
      Sun, Aug 03, 2014, 21:10
btw, here's a link to the same article without that insanely big head of Ambassador Stevens.
425sarge33rd
      ID: 390471112
      Sun, Aug 03, 2014, 21:25
lol that is annoying huh?
426Mith
      ID: 371172617
      Mon, Aug 04, 2014, 10:40
This is a time for introspection for anyone who spent the past two years hoping the president gets nailed for some scandal or other related to Benghazi.

They should be honestly asking themselves if they are relieved or disappointed to learn that in all that jumble of information, there was never anything of substance.

It's a golden opportunity to determine which is greater: their sense of earnest patriotism or their blind hate for the political opposition.
427sarge33rd
      ID: 390471112
      Mon, Aug 04, 2014, 10:57
brilliantly stated Mith.
 If you believe a recent post violates the policy on Civility and Respect,
you may report the abuse via email to moderators@rotoguru1.com 
RotoGuru Politics Forum

View the Forum Registry

XML Get RSS Feed for this thread


Self-edit this thread




Post a reply to this message: Benghazi

Name:
Email:
Message:
Click here to create and insert a link
Click here to insert a block of hidden (spoiler) text
Ignore line feeds? no (typical)   yes (for HTML table input)


Viewing statistics for this thread
Period# Views# Users
Last hour11
Last 24 hours11
Last 7 days55
Last 30 days1815
Since Mar 1, 200797491763